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Petrol & Diesel Cars to be Banned!

By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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The Govnmt has announced that new petrol & diesel car will be banned by 2040!

Its shocking init?

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*ssexBiker By *ssexBiker   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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I'll be in my 70's

I'll use the mobility scooter I'll have by then to go to the local cruising ground

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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I bet the new Charging Points, when installed, will have a higher rate of VAT on the electricity used in the car !

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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Commentators have suggested the ban will not happen, because if everyone plugs in their electric cars to get charged as soon as they get hope then the national grid wud not cope.

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By *HIOG  (M)  over a year ago

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It's estimated that totally electric cars would use about 16% if our electricity produced.

I'm sure it's only a matter of time before petrol and diesel are no longer used although methods of making such fuels cleaner is also a possibility.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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Petrol n diesel cars shud not be banned.

And now that we are leaving the ridiculous EU, all our coal power stations shud be re-opened so that we can have cheap electricity again.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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"Petrol n diesel cars shud not be banned.

And now that we are leaving the ridiculous EU, all our coal power stations shud be re-opened so that we can have cheap electricity again."

Do you know nothing of the damage of coal as a source of power? We need nuclear fusion technology as soon as possible and since battery tech is not exactly brilliant I would suggest hydrogen fuel cells that have been developed in Japan. Look at the droughts in Italy. That is the future and it's going to get far worse because of dirty energy resources like coal and gas.

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By *rselyker   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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Whats wrong with bio fuel hydrogen fuel how much do we need to pollute the planet

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By *HIOG  (M)  over a year ago

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"Petrol n diesel cars shud not be banned.

And now that we are leaving the ridiculous EU, all our coal power stations shud be re-opened so that we can have cheap electricity again."

Hahaha you really haven't got a clue have you.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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Chris seems intent on dragging us all back to the stone age...

I'll happily take advantage of the incoming diesel scrappage scheme and swap to electric... they're actually fairly decent motors now

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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"The Govnmt has announced that new petrol & diesel car will be banned by 2040!

Its shocking init?"

Not as shocking as if you get electrocuted by battery cars, Duracell batteries are expensive.

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By *ookin4fun59   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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Where will the government get the billions of pounds raised by fuel duty, only one place of course, your energy bill will rocket

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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Electricity will be at least 3 times more expensive than it is at present.

We know this because the govnmt has promised to pay the owners of Hinkley point c nuclear power station 3 times as much per kw for the electric it produces than what is currently paid to power stations.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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"Petrol n diesel cars shud not be banned.

And now that we are leaving the ridiculous EU, all our coal power stations shud be re-opened so that we can have cheap electricity again.

Do you know nothing of the damage of coal as a source of power? We need nuclear fusion technology as soon as possible and since battery tech is not exactly brilliant I would suggest hydrogen fuel cells that have been developed in Japan. Look at the droughts in Italy. That is the future and it's going to get far worse because of dirty energy resources like coal and gas."

As you say, Hydrogen technology exists, and of course, there is a never ending supply of the stuff ... BUT ..... its very expensive to harness.

Harness??? ...... now there's an idea .... giddyup there!

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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"Petrol n diesel cars shud not be banned.

And now that we are leaving the ridiculous EU, all our coal power stations shud be re-opened so that we can have cheap electricity again."

Here he goes again... A least he is consistent in his stupidity.

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By *ewcocol  (M)  over a year ago

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And we all know the saying "You can't fix stupid"

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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Politicians claim road pollution kills 40,000 people per year,but this is a blatant lie.

Even greenpeace says the figure is bogus,and that these victims are not real,and that it is more realistic to say that pollution shortens everyones life by about 2 days.

Therefore there is no need to ban petrol and diesel cars.

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By *ockStrapDaddy   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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They need to introduce Singapore style rules. New cars aren't a massive problem, it's the old bangers. Get anything over 15 (or 10) years old off the road.

Also, emission test some of the huge oil heated buildings in central London: the results would shock you!

All those cruise boats on the Thames, no regulations there either!

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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I think what they are saying is they will ban NEW petrol and diesel cars in 23 years times they are not saying they will get rid of old ones so add another 10-15 years on to that and by which time i wont give a feck.

And lets be serious is anyone going to get rid of some classic old car just because some loony bans them? The classic London to Brighton car race in milk floats. come on your having a laugh

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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Indeed... but they will also potentially add congestion type charges for diesels of any age, or even outright banning them from certain areas.

Time will tell and we'll have to wait and see, but it's not necessarily only new vehicles affected

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By *addude  (M)  over a year ago

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The National Grid struggles if people put the kettle on during breaks in sport(football), how are they going to cope when millions of cars all plug in.

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By *sunamiwarrior   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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It's fairly easy to place restrictions to diesels on specific roads and local authorities will be given cash incentives to do so.

Cameras on bus lanes show how easy it is but on a larger scale the London congestion charge and the LEZ around London restricting heavy vehicles.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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I am just thinking what is the electricity equivalent of "red" diesel.

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*ass65 By *ass65   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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The governments announcement implies that everything is on course for electric cars to eventually replace petrol or diesel cars by 2040, and all that’s needed is a government push to fund the infrastructure and overcome the inertia. Indeed, that’s what most people seem to think, that electric cars are inevitable and the only thing standing in the way of a wholesale switch over is the mindset of the public, hence the government should intervene to forcibly change it.

Nothing could be further from the truth. There are several massive hurdles to be overcome before

electric cars will become widespread.

1. Where is the electricity going to come from? Charging a few thousand cars is one thing, millions is something else. Whatever energy is currently being expended by burning petrol will have to be generated as electricity, minus any efficiency gains. The current grid is woefully undersized to meet such a demand, probably by an order of magnitude when you consider peak loadings. We could build lots of nuclear plants, but the people who want electric cars don’t like them.

Wind is never,ever going to generate much useful power and dependence on solar power requires a step-change in technology which I think will come, but we’re not there yet. Will we be there in 2040? I don’t know, and nor does anyone. Otherwise, we’ll have to build more gas-driven power stations. Will this be better or worse for the environment than the internal combustion engine? Nobody knows.

2. The problem with electric cars is not so much their range but the charging times.

Nobody is going to want to sit around for more than ten minutes waiting for their car to charge

unless it’s overnight or while at work, but that seriously restricts the car’s use to regular, short journeys. To overcome this we need a step-change in battery or energy storage technology which isn’t even on the horizon yet.

So that’s two technological step-changes we need by 2040.

3. Nobody has really looked at the environmental and economic costs of tens of millions of electric

cars. The batteries are big, heavy, and expensive and contain nasty substances. They don’t last long, so how will they be disposed of? How much will they cost to replace? What effect will this have on the used value of the car? Electric cars require nickel, copper, and cobalt. Where do we get this from? Where are the mines?

All these issues can be solved, but only once the real costs and externalities are known, and compared with the situation today. Right now nobody has a clue.

The governments consider they have picked a winner anyway, regardless of cost, which will be immense.

In their efforts to improve the quality of air in western cities, politicians might well be make the environment in the developing world worse, especially around the mines.

Also, the upgrade of infrastructure to handle mass car charging is enormous. Thousands of miles of new copper cabling will have to be installed,

but at what cost – both in cash and environmental terms? Apparently this is something governments

think they can do – the same governments that can’t manage to install proper cladding on apartment blocks.

However the AA warned that the National Grid would be under pressure to "cope with a mass switch-on after the evening rush hour", while Which? Car magazine warned that electric cars are currently more expensive and less practical.

According to a National Grid report, peak demand for electricity could add around 30 gigawatts to the current peak of 61GW - an increase of 50 per cent.

The extra electricity needed will be the equivalent of almost 10 times the total power output of the new Hinckley Point C nuclear power station being built in Somerset.

National Grid predicts Britain will become increasingly reliant on imported electricity, which will rise from around 10 per cent of total electricity to around one third, raising questions about energy.

If France also implement the same policy for electric cars by 2040, they will also require more generating capacity, as we import electricity from France will both countries upgrade generating capacity as required by 2040? If not where will the UK get the additional capacity from?

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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The claim that car pollution causes 40,000 deaths per year in the UK is the biggest load of crap to come out of the ridiculous EU yet!

I can accept if you live near a coal power station there cud be some detrimental effect on your health.

However,as long as you are a number of meters away from a car exhaust pipe any pollution will simlpy go up into the sky n away.

Its all lies, blatenent lies,and pointless rules n regs from the ridiculous EU, which has done so much damage to Britain over the past 40 yrs.

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By *HIOG  (M)  over a year ago

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"The claim that car pollution causes 40,000 deaths per year in the UK is the biggest load of crap to come out of the ridiculous EU yet!

I can accept if you live near a coal power station there cud be some detrimental effect on your health.

However,as long as you are a number of meters away from a car exhaust pipe any pollution will simlpy go up into the sky n away.

Its all lies, blatenent lies,and pointless rules n regs from the ridiculous EU, which has done so much damage to Britain over the past 40 yrs."

The EU aren't responsible for deaths in the UK due to car pollution. It's difficult to know how we came by the figure if 40,000 deaths per year which does seem high but if anything the regulations we have agreed within all the countries of the European Union can only have been beneficial in easing pollution and lessening the obvious problem we have whatever the true figures.

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By  *ebelatsea    profile verified by photo premium paying member (M)  over a year ago

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Taking the point about possible health damage from living near a coal fired power station. I lived about a mile away from Brentford gas works when it was in full swing, and had friends living alongside and working in the plant. The incidence of lung and chest related diseases was actually lower within a radius of 1 to 2 miles of the gas works than in the general population of London - go figure. Incidentally the big gas works produced and enormous range of things besides gas and coke, from coal tar to soaps and by products for the medical industries. All of which we now have to import or synthesize in other ways.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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"The claim that car pollution causes 40,000 deaths per year in the UK is the biggest load of crap to come out of the ridiculous EU yet!

I can accept if you live near a coal power station there cud be some detrimental effect on your health.

However,as long as you are a number of meters away from a car exhaust pipe any pollution will simlpy go up into the sky n away.

Its all lies, blatenent lies,and pointless rules n regs from the ridiculous EU, which has done so much damage to Britain over the past 40 yrs."

As usual you don't let's facts get in the way a stupid statement

The 40000 figure comes from a report by the The royal college of physicians and reported by Cambridge university

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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"Politicians claim road pollution kills 40,000 people per year,but this is a blatant lie.

Even greenpeace says the figure is bogus,and that these victims are not real,and that it is more realistic to say that pollution shortens everyones life by about 2 days.

Therefore there is no need to ban petrol and diesel cars."

Politicians don't say that, at all. I believe the words are along the lines of, 40,000 deaths per year can be associated with bad air quality. I would further add, that a reasonably well published experiment took place some 10 years ago, whereby it was proved that an hour spent walking up and down a busy town thoroughfare, was worse for your lungs than spending an entire month, 24/7, in the smokiest pub imaginable. So why were successive governments leading with people to turn to diesel? Makes you wonder, doesn't it? ....

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By *ewcocol  (M)  over a year ago

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I didn't realise we had so many dinosaurs on the forum. It feels almost a waste of effort to counter the silliness of some of the propaganda you have lapped up, arguments may not penetrate the sand heads are buried in.

However, because I must have a built in aversion towards allowing bullshit to go unchallenged. .....

Studies show that 90% of cars are sitting unused by their owners for about 90% of the time. Mine is probably sitting in the street outside for much less than 10% of it's life for sure. Pretty much all EVs will be charged overnight, unless a journey in excess of it's range is being undertaken. The national grid has a significant problem with what is known as the bathtub effect, high demand through the daytimes and early evening, dropping significantly into the night. Smoothing out these peaks and troughs by increasing demand through the night is of significant benefit on the national Grid. Coupled with an inversely proportional drop in demand for oil refineries to produce petrol and diesel will give a much more efficient grid. An average oil refinery uses as much electricity from the grid as a medium sized city.

A youtube video from 5 years ago explains this much quicker than I could, and things have moved on massively in the years since 2012.

https://youtu.be/vX0G9F42puY

For those going on about having a useles, expensive battery to replace eight years or so after a car is new, how many of you have asked yourselves how much it will cost to replace your V6 or diesel engine, which has a three, or at best, five, year warranty. It costs around £1200 to £1500 just to put a new clutch in most modern cars with the bringing in of things like dual mass flywheels etc. (A friend of mine has just been quoted £1500 from Toyota to renew his clutch at 80,000 miles in his Avensis)

for those who scream to reopen coal mines I don't hear you saying you would be willing to actually go underground and do the bloody job, or be happy with your children to be doing that job. I for one would never even consider doing such a horrible job, and I suspect that those who say they would will be lying to us and to themselves.

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By *ewcocol  (M)  over a year ago

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Oops I typed much less than 10% when I should have put much more.

Careless reviewing tut tut.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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A pointless and waste of time discussion from whatever angle you take. It will never happen,,,Far too many of the "elite" the politicians, wealthy influential (basically, "the money") will never allow it to occur!! Besides that,, what is the "fuel" that is going to generate all the electricity to "recharge millions of batteries! What will all the rich "playboys" be posing around in,, battery powered Tonka toys?! Even "electric trains.. have huge diesel engines to drive the generators to power the motors to drive the bloody things along!! FACT at least 85 to 90 % of the electric you pay for on your electric bill,, is returned to the grid! You are paying 100% of your meter readings,,,you will at maximum have actually "consumed" around 10 to 15 %, the rest is returned straight back to the grid! Don't believe me,,,? before you contradict me, check it out,, ask any proper honest qualified electrician that actually knows more than how to wire a plug!!

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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A pointless and waste of time discussion from whatever angle you take. It will never happen,,,Far too many of the "elite" the politicians, wealthy influential (basically, "the money") will never allow it to occur!! Besides that,, what is the "fuel" that is going to generate all the electricity to "recharge millions of batteries! What will all the rich "playboys" be posing around in,, battery powered Tonka toys?! Even "electric trains.. have huge diesel engines to drive the generators to power the motors to drive the bloody things along!! FACT at least 85 to 90 % of the electric you pay for on your electric bill,, is returned to the grid! You are paying 100% of your meter readings,,,you will at maximum have actually "consumed" around 10 to 15 %, the rest is returned straight back to the grid! Don't believe me,,,? Before you contradict me, check it out,, ask any proper honest qualified electrician that actually knows more than how to wire a plug!!Electricity is supplied on a "loop", your home is connected to that loop,,,like a flowing river,, you may connect your hosepipe and syphon off some water,, but you are paying for all of the water that flows past or through the watercourse!

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By *aladin1950  (M)  over a year ago

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"I didn't realise we had so many dinosaurs on the forum. It feels almost a waste of effort to counter the silliness of some of the propaganda you have lapped up, arguments may not penetrate the sand heads are buried in.

However, because I must have a built in aversion towards allowing bullshit to go unchallenged. .....

Studies show that 90% of cars are sitting unused by their owners for about 90% of the time. Mine is probably sitting in the street outside for much less than 10% of it's life for sure. Pretty much all EVs will be charged overnight, unless a journey in excess of it's range is being undertaken. The national grid has a significant problem with what is known as the bathtub effect, high demand through the daytimes and early evening, dropping significantly into the night. Smoothing out these peaks and troughs by increasing demand through the night is of significant benefit on the national Grid. Coupled with an inversely proportional drop in demand for oil refineries to produce petrol and diesel will give a much more efficient grid. An average oil refinery uses as much electricity from the grid as a medium sized city.

A youtube video from 5 years ago explains this much quicker than I could, and things have moved on massively in the years since 2012.

https://youtu.be/vX0G9F42puY

For those going on about having a useles, expensive battery to replace eight years or so after a car is new, how many of you have asked yourselves how much it will cost to replace your V6 or diesel engine, which has a three, or at best, five, year warranty. It costs around £1200 to £1500 just to put a new clutch in most modern cars with the bringing in of things like dual mass flywheels etc. (A friend of mine has just been quoted £1500 from Toyota to renew his clutch at 80,000 miles in his Avensis)

for those who scream to reopen coal mines I don't hear you saying you would be willing to actually go underground and do the bloody job, or be happy with your children to be doing that job. I for one would never even consider doing such a horrible job, and I suspect that those who say they would will be lying to us and to themselves. "

An excellent and informative post. Shame about the proof reader.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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There's a delightful irony in all of this - Gov't, in the persona of Mr Grayling, have just cancelled 3 electrification schemes on the railway as the increasing availability of bi-mode trains means they can run on both electrified and non-electrified lines. The other bit of power they employ? Diesel!! I wonder what the Gov't will do about them in 2040 which in terms of railway stock is not that far away.

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By *hris48mt  (M)  over a year ago

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Electricity is not supplied on a loop to any premises. I can,t think where this idea could come from.

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By *sunamiwarrior   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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"Electricity is not supplied on a loop to any premises. I can,t think where this idea could come from."

.

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By *ewcocol  (M)  over a year ago

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Electrons move in a closed loop. I wonder if he is mixing this up with a ring main.

If electricity moved through the infrastructure in a big loop wouldn't that, theoretically, have the potential to become a giant inductor? That wouldn't end well really.

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By *hris48mt  (M)  over a year ago

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Yes, that sounds logical. English regs require all sockets on the consumer side of the meter to be wired on a ring main system.

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By *ndyBath  (M)  over a year ago

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It seems to me that many of you are missing the point here.

The announcement was that the government plan to ban the sale of NEW petrol and diesel cars from 2040 not used.

This means that from 2040, petrol and diesel cars will start to be phased out as they reach the end of their lives and are scrapped and it puts pressure on car manufacturers to put more investment into alternative energies.

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By *aladin1950  (M)  over a year ago

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"It seems to me that many of you are missing the point here.

The announcement was that the government plan to ban the sale of NEW petrol and diesel cars from 2040 not used.

This means that from 2040, petrol and diesel cars will start to be phased out as they reach the end of their lives and are scrapped and it puts pressure on car manufacturers to put more investment into alternative energies.

"

It has to happen sooner or later and many countries have made the same pledges to be implemented much sooner.

In the next twenty years there could be improvements or new products which haven't even been thought of yet. We already have a choice of several other fuels apart from battery power if it can be produced in a way that makes it viable.

All our power from wind, water and sun will be produced with modernised technology.

I am guessing it will all be almost unrecognisable by today's standards and will mean a much cleaner environment and more plentiful energy sources.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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"

It has to happen sooner or later and many countries have made the same pledges to be implemented much sooner.

In the next twenty years there could be improvements or new products which haven't even been thought of yet. We already have a choice of several other fuels apart from battery power if it can be produced in a way that makes it viable.

All our power from wind, water and sun will be produced with modernised technology.

I am guessing it will all be almost unrecognisable by today's standards and will mean a much cleaner environment and more plentiful energy sources."

And meanwhile back on planet earth....... If you think we will suddenly start getting most of our electricity from cleaner sources in that time timescales even though we have been discussing it for 50 years your in La La Land.

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By *HIOG  (M)  over a year ago

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"

It has to happen sooner or later and many countries have made the same pledges to be implemented much sooner.

In the next twenty years there could be improvements or new products which haven't even been thought of yet. We already have a choice of several other fuels apart from battery power if it can be produced in a way that makes it viable.

All our power from wind, water and sun will be produced with modernised technology.

I am guessing it will all be almost unrecognisable by today's standards and will mean a much cleaner environment and more plentiful energy sources.

And meanwhile back on planet earth....... If you think we will suddenly start getting most of our electricity from cleaner sources in that time timescales even though we have been discussing it for 50 years your in La La Land."

What would you suggest? We just sit back and watch fuel supplies depleted while we carry on pumping poisons into the atmosphere? Surely it's better that something is being done.

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By *arconi  (M)  over a year ago

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It all sounds very Utopian but when the Chancellor discovers the revenue from Petrol and Diesel tax is no more then he/she will slap a hefty tax on electricity. How he/she will differentiate between domestic use and vehicle use will be interesting.

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By *HIOG  (M)  over a year ago

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"It all sounds very Utopian but when the Chancellor discovers the revenue from Petrol and Diesel tax is no more then he/she will slap a hefty tax on electricity. How he/she will differentiate between domestic use and vehicle use will be interesting."

When discussing electricity I will always trust someone named _arconi.

They will have to tax the electricity to pay for the enormous infrastructure required but they may kep costs much lower than the present fuel prices.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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Its all a load bollocks!

Petrol n diesel cars dont cause no harm to anyone.

Theres simply no need to ban them.

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By *HIOG  (M)  over a year ago

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"Its all a load bollocks!

Petrol n diesel cars dont cause no harm to anyone.

Theres simply no need to ban them."

I bet you smoke instead of doing any exercise - good man lol.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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"Its all a load bollocks!

Petrol n diesel cars dont cause no harm to anyone.

Theres simply no need to ban them."

thus speakes the UKIP voice of reason. Have you got pictures of Trump on your walls too?

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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Trump is a clown.

UKIP are the voice of common sense in British politics.

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By *sunamiwarrior   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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At the present time UKIP aren't the voice of anything.

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By *ewcocol  (M)  over a year ago

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"Trump is a clown.

UKIP are the voice of common sense in British politics."

Your poster boy Nigel has a different view. He's over in America sucking Trump's wizened dick quite often.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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Trump is a fan of Nigel Farage ( as were the 4m Brits who voted UKIP in 2015).

Its a shame the party has collapsed somewhat.

With the millionare Conservatives n idiotic Labour Britain is crying out for a strong 3rd voice.

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By *sunamiwarrior   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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Trump and Farage have a lot in common as they are both bigoted racists. Farage is a better speaker but Trump is wicked with his Tweets.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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"Trump is a fan of Nigel Farage ( as were the 4m Brits who voted UKIP in 2015).

Its a shame the party has collapsed somewhat.

With the millionare Conservatives n idiotic Labour Britain is crying out for a strong 3rd voice."

When you first posted this kind of rubbish I thought you were a troll trying to have a laugh and felt sorry for you as that is a very sad way to behave

Now I feel even more sorry for you because you do seem to actually believe this crap

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By *ewcocol  (M)  over a year ago

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And less than 600,000 in the 2017 election.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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Even 600,000 votes wud secure 12 common sense MPs in a Parliament elected by proportional representation.

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By *ewcocol  (M)  over a year ago

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"Even 600,000 votes wud secure 12 common sense MPs in a Parliament elected by proportional representation."

UKIP don't appear to have 12 common sense people to put forward as MPs so that shoots that notion in the foot. The people who appear on television or radio all turn out to be fruitcakes and Nuttalls.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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Why is idiotic Labour so against proportional representation?

Its not like they are ever guna win another election on their own again.

They were handed the last election on a plate n still ended up with 60 fewer MPs than the millionare Conservatives.

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By *HIOG  (M)  over a year ago

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UKIP MEP Bill Etheridge is frightened and has dropped out of the leadership race, warning against the risk of extremism within the party and what he called an obsession with Islam among some members.

Even UKIP now have to admit they are the racist party. Gained support due to their racist agenda. Dropped the country in the shit and then disappeared.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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Yorkshire MEP Jane Collins is probably one of the best candidates to be the new UKIP leader.

If the party goes down the anti islam EDL route then its definitely finished.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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"Trump is a fan of Nigel Farage ( as were the 4m Brits who voted UKIP in 2015).

Its a shame the party has collapsed somewhat.

With the millionare Conservatives n idiotic Labour Britain is crying out for a strong 3rd voice."

and your lot isn't it!

You're a spent protest vote destined to live in history with a claim to have been part of the biggest disruption in modern UK history. I'd rather vote SNP than UKIP

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M)  over a year ago

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I'd vote almost anything rather than UKIP, especially if their 'voice of common sense' on here is anything to go by. Not exactly an eloquent apologist.

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By *onavan69  (M)  over a year ago

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we had two world wars and aload of people died for us to be free ,so why are we getting told that we have to get eletric cars ,why can't we have what we got ,as there not that bad what about the planes or the trucks that travel the land ,it's some littel sod saying that its killing far to many people what about cancer ,drinking the list is long we can't just say its the transport we need to live ,as loads of people will be stuck in doors or cant get to a place as no transport links .

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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" we had two world wars and aload of people died for us to be free ,so why are we getting told that we have to get eletric cars ,why can't we have what we got ,as there not that bad what about the planes or the trucks that travel the land ,it's some littel sod saying that its killing far to many people what about cancer ,drinking the list is long we can't just say its the transport we need to live ,as loads of people will be stuck in doors or cant get to a place as no transport links ."

TwWo words.... nanny state..... says it all really.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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" we had two world wars and aload of people died for us to be free ,so why are we getting told that we have to get eletric cars ,why can't we have what we got ,as there not that bad what about the planes or the trucks that travel the land ,it's some littel sod saying that its killing far to many people what about cancer ,drinking the list is long we can't just say its the transport we need to live ,as loads of people will be stuck in doors or cant get to a place as no transport links .

TwWo words.... nanny state..... says it all really. "

And yes - i am pissed......

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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fed up of being told what to do and they can all sod off love my cars and re wine

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By *ewcocol  (M)  over a year ago

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" we had two world wars and aload of people died for us to be free ,so why are we getting told that we have to get eletric cars ,why can't we have what we got ,as there not that bad what about the planes or the trucks that travel the land ,it's some littel sod saying that its killing far to many people what about cancer ,drinking the list is long we can't just say its the transport we need to live ,as loads of people will be stuck in doors or cant get to a place as no transport links ."

Before you start off a post with the words "we had two world wars and a load of people died for us to be free" it may serve you well to find out what were the causes and events that led to war breaking out.

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By *hebestrimmer  (M)  over a year ago

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Well, if they do get thier way with this I think we can safely say some of the old bastards wont live to see it, and what with Trump, Putin, that cockhead from Korea, and maggie may none of us might live to see it!!!!

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By *eedude   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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Why has Germany then opened six new coal fired power plants in 2013 then? Look at Fukishima and Chernobyl to see how well nuclear has gone.

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By *aladin1950  (M)  over a year ago

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"Why has Germany then opened six new coal fired power plants in 2013 then? Look at Fukishima and Chernobyl to see how well nuclear has gone."

Chernobyl and Fukushima were ancient power stations using ancient technology. Modern nuclear reactors are much different in design and far safer.

The biggest killer of people has been the coal mines in which the number of deaths has been staggering.

Many people are frightened of anything nuclear, perhaps due to it being invisible and a difficult scientific concept to grasp, but I'm not convinced we have a better power source.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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just some political asshole being a plonker

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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It's not going to happen end of, how far do you think a 40ft lorry and trailer fully loaded will get on batteries alone??? 1/2 hour up the road if you're lucky,the battery would far out weigh the load capacity, same as our dust carts get half a street done then be stuck blocking the road as nowhere to plug in and recharge, same as buses, ambulance, plant hire, cranes,diggers, landfill site vehicles, so nothing in our shops, rubbish polluting our environment , rats and diseases everywhere, hit men from the oil companies shooting the government twats that decided on the strategy and are taking away trillions of ?? from them, not enough power stations to produce the electricity we will need so a country in darkness with anarchy on the streets, oh yea and the dozy twats in government wondering what's happened to the billions and billions of ?? they got from fuel taxes??but it's not going to happen ever as we can't even build enough power plants to cope with our needs now, would take minimum of 50 years to build them, then put the inferstructure together for recharging points across the country, takes roughly 8-10 hours to recharge a family size car at present so how long for trucks, buses etc complete fabrication to gain votes is my honest opinion, would need to find the millions of people currently employed in the fuel trade now new jobs too

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By *HIOG  (M)  over a year ago

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It's already happening in many countries including the uk. We have plenty of electric only cars running locally. Hybrids for driving further afield. Local authorities are big users of electric vehicles. Cities are running electric buses in enormous numbers.

A lot of large transport companies are using biofuels and experimenting with electric and hybrid vehicles.

Common sense dictates it will happen.

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By *HIOG  (M)  over a year ago

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"Why has Germany then opened six new coal fired power plants in 2013 then? Look at Fukishima and Chernobyl to see how well nuclear has gone.

Chernobyl and Fukushima were ancient power stations using ancient technology. Modern nuclear reactors are much different in design and far safer.

The biggest killer of people has been the coal mines in which the number of deaths has been staggering.

Many people are frightened of anything nuclear, perhaps due to it being invisible and a difficult scientific concept to grasp, but I'm not convinced we have a better power source.

"

Zackly.

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By *onnie21360  (M)  over a year ago

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what about busses and lorrys jcb's ect

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By *HIOG  (M)  over a year ago

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"what about busses and lorrys jcb's ect

"

I refer the right honourable gentleman to my previous reply.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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" Before you start off a post with the words "we had two world wars and a load of people died for us to be free" it may serve you well to find out what were the causes and events that led to war breaking out."

Hitler got a bee in his bonnet and threw a wobbler.

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By *ljcleeve   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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" Before you start off a post with the words "we had two world wars and a load of people died for us to be free" it may serve you well to find out what were the causes and events that led to war breaking out. Hitler got a bee in his bonnet and threw a wobbler. "

It looks like you need to read a bit more about the subject before making such a stupid, ignorant comment.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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I wish people would look further than their nose ends!! The suggested ban on new diesel and petrol is another HS2 .......... its a means of job creation. Nobody needs HS2 but the resulting taxes from the people employed on it, and the self financing from material and land purchase will swell the coffers to the point where it pays for itself ..... without, as I say, there being an actual need for it. Electric car introduction is a similar ploy. The creation of the infrastructure to service such basic change in habit, is enormous, requiring a lot of people to do a lot of things, creating lots of lovely jobs which results in loads of lovely tax. You wait and see, once the electricity thing has landed, the next change will be to hydrogen, and the merry go round starts again ..... for the same reason ...... We can't make money by the old fashioned methods anymore, we have to bring about change in order to force employment. I'm not saying its wrong, I'm just saying that its the name of the game from now on.

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*etropolis By *etropolis   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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Where do think the money to pay the workers will come from? Oh yes... public funds. So the government will be taxing the money it has already paid out. Who buys the land? The government!

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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Soon be back in the land of the barbarians - they're that way

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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"Where do think the money to pay the workers will come from? Oh yes... public funds. So the government will be taxing the money it has already paid out. Who buys the land? The government!"

What???? .... you seriously think the Government will be building the damned thing? Are you bonkers? They can't even build council houses, never mind state of the art railways. It will be private concerns that build, and private concerns that buy the land.

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*etropolis By *etropolis   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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Not as bonkers as you.

To force someone to sell their land, a Compulsory Purchase Order has to be granted. Only statutory bodies can obtain one, not Joe the builder.

Those seeking to provide infrastructure such as railways, will have to apply under the Transport and Works Act 1992.

As for housing, most social housing is now built and managed by Housing Associations, not the Government.

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By *hebestrimmer  (M)  over a year ago

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And the money the politicians will make from it because they will all have fingers in the till

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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"Not as bonkers as you.

To force someone to sell their land, a Compulsory Purchase Order has to be granted. Only statutory bodies can obtain one, not Joe the builder.

Those seeking to provide infrastructure such as railways, will have to apply under the Transport and Works Act 1992.

As for housing, most social housing is now built and managed by Housing Associations, not the Government."

Give me strength! Yes, and yes to the above, but it doesn't mean to say that the statutory body who has gained the compulsory po is the body who actually builds on that land. It will be sold to the developer ..... at a profit. Most social housing is built by private companies and "given" to the council who sells to the housing association.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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I just think the OP should have read the COMPLETE Government press release on this subject he has missed out the words.....Conventional Petrol and Diesel.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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"I just think the OP should have read the COMPLETE Government press release on this subject he has missed out the words.....Conventional Petrol and Diesel. "

Come on BK be serious, you expect them to be able to read not just listen to sound bites.....

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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They will never ban petrol and derv cars . They make to much money on then. 80 percent of the price of fuel goes to profit fuel companies and governments you realy think they will give that up . Ha ha

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By *ong tall mart   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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What many people are unaware of is that we NEED electric cars in parallel with green energy generation and I don't mean because of the environment.

The simple fact is, if we are going to rely on wind and solar (which we could in this country and even sell power abroad if we add some wave generators) we also need lots and lots of storage batteries and electric cars are an easy solution the government doesn't have to pay for.

There is a short video explaining why here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5uz6xOFWi4A

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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Indeed, environmental issues aside, fossil fuels aren't an infinite resource... current estimates are that we'll run out of oil in 55 years at our current consumption.

Electric isn't really an option, it's a necessity

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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Im all in favour of green energy wind and solar power, but that doesnt mean that you have to ban petrol n diesel cars!

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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You gonna make your own oil in 55 years time... or is this more of a "I'll be dead by then, so fuck everyone else" mentality?

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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Im not against electric cars, some taxi firms use em in Leeds, very quiet engines lol.

Just dont see why petrol n diesel cars have to be banned.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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I have said this before in this thread but if the OP actually read the press release from Michael Gove, the Environmental Secretary of State you might have learnt something??? The UK government will by 2040 ban the “SALE” of new “conventional” petrol and diesel powered cars, although hybrids would still be allowed and continued research into cleaner and more efficient engines is and will continue to be undertaken by manufacturers.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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As from Tuesday 1st August all lorries, coaches, vans and cars will be road side checked throughout the United Kingdom from the DVSA searching for those who have fitted cheat devices to exhausts and for fake soot filters. This will continue for about a year and those caught will have their vehicles impounded…………and about time to. This will then be looked at as to continue with these road side checks.

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By *ong tall mart   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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I don't know why people are stressing anyway, electric motors are far better for road vehicles than internal combustion engines, they don't need gearboxes, they have way less moving parts, they need less servicing, they are cheaper to produce, they weigh less for the same power output, they produce maximum torque from zero RPM (which is why they don't need gearboxes)and they consume no power while they are not moving.

Battery technology will either catch up or be replaced by superconducting capacitors, or hydrogen fuel cells, or some as yet un-thought of tech that make electricity (How about a big jar full of electric eels?).

Much like steam edged out horses and petrol/diesel edged out steam the same will happen with electric cars.

The government wont have to ban the sale of new cars, Volvo had already said they were going to stop making IC engines for their cars, eventually the current crop of naysayers will be moaning they cant afford an electric car and still have to drive their old slow, expensive oil burner.

I'm a petrol head, i've had all sorts of weird cars and still own a classic as well as a daily driver so im not anti oil, but people can bleat and cry and talk bollocks about things they have no real understanding of as much as they want ic engines are on the way out, its been a known fact since the 70's they were not sustainable in the long term.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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This is no "idea" it's a fact, your,home, your business ,etc, is on a supply that goes back to the power station, it has to be ,, to work,, you only use a fraction of the power you are paying for,,,if you do not believe me .. ask a fully qualified electrical engineer to explain it to you,,as a consumer you are tapping a loop ,,, from the power station,, all around the national grid , and back to the power station,simple physics, ,, and you tap into that, but actually "consume" a fraction of that power!!

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By *HIOG  (M)  over a year ago

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"I don't know why people are stressing anyway, electric motors are far better for road vehicles than internal combustion engines, they don't need gearboxes, they have way less moving parts, they need less servicing, they are cheaper to produce, they weigh less for the same power output, they produce maximum torque from zero RPM (which is why they don't need gearboxes)and they consume no power while they are not moving.

Battery technology will either catch up or be replaced by superconducting capacitors, or hydrogen fuel cells, or some as yet un-thought of tech that make electricity (How about a big jar full of electric eels?).

Much like steam edged out horses and petrol/diesel edged out steam the same will happen with electric cars.

The government wont have to ban the sale of new cars, Volvo had already said they were going to stop making IC engines for their cars, eventually the current crop of naysayers will be moaning they cant afford an electric car and still have to drive their old slow, expensive oil burner.

I'm a petrol head, i've had all sorts of weird cars and still own a classic as well as a daily driver so im not anti oil, but people can bleat and cry and talk bollocks about things they have no real understanding of as much as they want ic engines are on the way out, its been a known fact since the 70's they were not sustainable in the long term. "

Zackly.

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By *hris48mt  (M)  over a year ago

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Cleo, there are posts about this. There is no loop. And you are not fed from a power station, 132,000 volts would,nt do your computer much good. Your supply comes from a sub station somewhere on you estate.

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By *ewcocol  (M)  over a year ago

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I think you are mingling together a couple of different concepts with your 'loopy idea, .... sorry I meant loop, ignore the typo.

Perhaps you could enlighten me, and everyone else, where the giant storage containers (commonly known as batteries) are located for all that unused electricity are when it has arrived back at the power station.

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By *hris48mt  (M)  over a year ago

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Thanks Newcool, for helping to restore a bit of common sense.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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You're talking through your ass, Cleo

It's not possible to store large amounts of electricity, there is no loop... the national grid monitors usage by the hour constantly, and either increases or decreases power to meet demand at any given time.

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By *ewcocol  (M)  over a year ago

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"Thanks Newcool, for helping to restore a bit of common sense."

It's an uphill struggle on here, but like that Greek fucker that was pushing the rock up the hill, you just not got to weaken.

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*ass65 By *ass65   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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"You're talking through your ass, Cleo

It's not possible to store large amounts of electricity, there is no loop... the national grid monitors usage by the hour constantly, and either increases or decreases power to meet demand at any given time."

Correct, in practical terms, electricity cannot be stored.

The only way to physically store electricity directly is via superconducting rings, which are absurdly expensive and impractical. Superconductors have zero electrical resistance and therefore allow electricity to rotate in a closed circle without dissipating. It's unworkable for grid-scale storage.

The superconductors have to be kept refrigerated to a cryogenic temperature very close to absolute zero. And the more energy you want to store, the larger the ring diameter has to be -- so they get impossibly large at high storage capacities.

For practical purposes you can't store the electricity itself, so it has to be converted into some other form.

Such as:-

Inductors store electricity in a magnetic field.

Capacitors store electricity in an electrostatic charge. Mostly used in surge protection.

Batteries store electricity by using a redox reaction to convert it to galvanic potential energy (a form of chemical energy).

Hydrogen synthesis stores electricity by splitting water into hydrogen and oxygen, which can be burned for heat or run through a fuel cell to get electricity directly (another form of chemical energy).

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By *ong tall mart   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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Potential energy can also include things like spinning up flywheels, compressing air in large tanks or pumping water uphill so that it can be released to drive turbines when power is needed.

None of which are particularly efficient, but they are simple technologies and can work to store large amounts of energy.

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By *ajor mistake  (M)  over a year ago

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Only new cars will be banned, nothing will stop you from buying a second hand car, unless of course the government brings in a age limiting rule, where your car is deemed to be scraped after 10 years, i can see that one coming in before any ban, with exceptions for classic cars,25 years or older.

All that any ban on buying new petrol ,or diesel cars, vans etc will do is to either push people towards older more polluting vehicles, or price some out of driving all together.

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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Major Mistake, this is what I wrote 1 day ago and it starts tomorrow AUGUST 1st 2017......and I quote "As from Tuesday 1st August all lorries, coaches, vans and cars will be road side checked throughout the United Kingdom from the DVSA searching for those who have fitted cheat devices to exhausts and for fake soot filters. This will continue for about a year and those caught will have their vehicles impounded…………and about time to. This will then be looked at as to continue with these road side checks".End quote

So again the Government is stepping up its attempt to get rid of all OLD diesel and petrol cars which do polute.

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By *sunamiwarrior   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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"Major Mistake, this is what I wrote 1 day ago and it starts tomorrow AUGUST 1st 2017......and I quote "As from Tuesday 1st August all lorries, coaches, vans and cars will be road side checked throughout the United Kingdom from the DVSA searching for those who have fitted cheat devices to exhausts and for fake soot filters. This will continue for about a year and those caught will have their vehicles impounded…………and about time to. This will then be looked at as to continue with these road side checks".End quote

So again the Government is stepping up its attempt to get rid of all OLD diesel and petrol cars which do polute."

.

They can set up plenty of checkpoints as they have an enormous surplus of cash from last year. I think they will be generally checking commercials.

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By *ewcocol  (M)  over a year ago

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What it means, in a practical sense I suspect, is that during the sporadic roadside tests they currently do they will now also check for this as well. It is unlikely that a stop will be made just for that particular purpose, unless the vehicle is visibly throwing out clouds of smoke.

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By *ustful  (M)  over a year ago

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If I remember rightly it was government that encouraged us to buy diesel cars a few years ago.

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By *sunamiwarrior   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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"If I remember rightly it was government that encouraged us to buy diesel cars a few years ago."

.

It was the world's scientific experts who were recommending diesel as a preferable fuel but science moves on and new discoveries are made.

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By *arcusUK2  (M)  over a year ago

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Not quite. Any scientist with an O Level (not a GCSE, a real O level) will tell you that petrol cars give off more CO2, and diesel cars more soot.

The government at the time wanted to voluntarily aim for the EU targets on reductions in CO2, because we all wanted to save the fluffy polar bears, so they told us to buy Diesels. I was never conned by this crap.

Now they have a new target - soot and general air polution. So now we need to get away from diesel.

It's not the scientists - it's the politicians, and the ignorant public who believe what an ignorant journalist says when he begins an article with "Scientists say..."

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By (user no longer on site)  over a year ago

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I drive diesel cause it's cheap to run, and lower co2 simply translates to lower tax... I'm sure most people have the same reasoning.

But if it makes you feel superior to believe diesel drivers are sheep, knock yourself out

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By *lbino1951   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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They are on about banning diesel vehicles, but one of the places I am working at they two car parks one for visitors and petrol vehicles, with the other for diesel. Contractors who are actually working on the site vehicles and generators for equipment have to be diesel. The risk factor of a spark is the reason. This can be dangerous to what the place consists of.

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By *HIOG  (M)  over a year ago

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"If I remember rightly it was government that encouraged us to buy diesel cars a few years ago.

.

It was the world's scientific experts who were recommending diesel as a preferable fuel but science moves on and new discoveries are made. "

Scientists, medical experts and relevent advisors change their minds all the time. Smoking used to be good for you lol.

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By *ong tall mart   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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"Major Mistake, this is what I wrote 1 day ago and it starts tomorrow AUGUST 1st 2017......and I quote "As from Tuesday 1st August all lorries, coaches, vans and cars will be road side checked throughout the United Kingdom from the DVSA searching for those who have fitted cheat devices to exhausts and for fake soot filters. This will continue for about a year and those caught will have their vehicles impounded…………and about time to. This will then be looked at as to continue with these road side checks".End quote

So again the Government is stepping up its attempt to get rid of all OLD diesel and petrol cars which do polute.

.

They can set up plenty of checkpoints as they have an enormous surplus of cash from last year. I think they will be generally checking commercials. "

DVSA is not government funded, they get all their cash from fining drivers and operators, if people behaved they wouldn't have any money.

I've been pulled over twice in the last year by the DVSA for random checks, got one £100 fine for a late break one day but the truck was all good both times.

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By *ong tall mart   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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"If I remember rightly it was government that encouraged us to buy diesel cars a few years ago.

.

It was the world's scientific experts who were recommending diesel as a preferable fuel but science moves on and new discoveries are made.

Scientists, medical experts and relevent advisors change their minds all the time. Smoking used to be good for you lol. "

Only while the tobaccos companies were paying for the research.

Science all ways moves on, that's what science is all about, new data means new results but that doesn't mean we can just ignore advice in case its found wrong later.

We know science works more often than not, if it didn't we wouldn't be typing on here.

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*ass65 By *ass65   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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The problem is that many so called experts, and super highly qualified specialists, scientists etc. Often they get money for research from companies who's main interest is to promote their particular source of revenue, i.e. motor industry, oil industry drugs, etc.

While they may have the best intentions at the time, it is always the ones who pay them that decide what part of that research is used, and if infact it is used, or they bury it as being against their long term interest, hence I feel the recommendation of diesel cars, against the up and coming at the time more efficient petrol and duel fuel, maybe the motor industry would have had a surplus of diesels they wanted to get rid of, before everyone realised that there was an, as yet at the time, undisclosed problem with diesel cars, i.e. emissions tests!!!!

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By *ong tall mart   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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There was lots of info in the motoring press about DERV producing different kinds of pollution AND about due to higher buying and servicing costs they were not even cheaper for the average buyer.

That didn't stop people rushing out to buy them based on a few Dailyfail articles and some crap spouted by government spokesmen.

If people can't be arsed to do more research than just blindly following what they are told before letting themselves be separated from large chunks of their money that's tough and no good moaning afterwards.

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By *emused   profile verified by photo (M)  over a year ago

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Many buyers and journalists are obsessed with the sensationlism of low or zero VED rates and theoreticaal and unobtainable mpg figures when they should be looking at the whole of life costs including servicing and depreciation and real life mpg over the full period they expect to own the car.

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