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ferry's with no ships

By *orum reader   premium paying member (M) 2 weeks ago

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can someone please explain the logic behind awarding a £13.5 billion contract to use ferry's for extra crossing's in the event of a no deal on the brexit negotiations, to a brand new company with no ships at all ?

i know Grayling says he proud to support a new British business but there must be some sort of explanation

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By *udekeith  (M) 2 weeks ago

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Probably someone in government wants to get inside the trousers of the “shipping” company boss.

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"can someone please explain the logic behind awarding a £13.5 billion contract to use ferry's for extra crossing's in the event of a no deal on the brexit negotiations, to a brand new company with no ships at all ?

i know Grayling says he proud to support a new British business but there must be some sort of explanation"

maybe if you look at the tendrils of the ownership of that company you may find a veritable spiders web of connections to Grayling, his associates and many more of the parasites we are obliged to call the British Government.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"can someone please explain the logic behind awarding a £13.5 billion contract to use ferry's for extra crossing's in the event of a no deal on the brexit negotiations, to a brand new company with no ships at all ?

i know Grayling says he proud to support a new British business but there must be some sort of explanation"

There is no logic - sounds very fishy, like may government contracts.

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 2 weeks ago

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You never know with these contracts but this one doesn’t seem so odd. From what I understand the contract is worth £100,000,000 and shared by three companies. The other two take the lions share although neither of them are British and the much smaller contract has gone to the British start up company which will hopefully pay dividends in the longer term especially once we have Brexited and are going it alone.

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By *annyboy87  (M) 2 weeks ago

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So why is none British company getting lion share of British money

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 2 weeks ago

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I’m not sure if we have any large British ferry companies but governments have to decide on many factors particularly expense.

Good to see some money going to a British company for a change.

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By *uclid   profile verified by photo (M) 2 weeks ago

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Personally I cannot see why we would require more ferries, unless the government are expecting a mass exodus of east European truckers and workers, or will the tunnel charges be increased

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 2 weeks ago

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I believe it’s to move our own trucks and freight should we c9me away with a no deal Brexit. When we are out of the EU our transport companies will have to revert to the old slow and complicated documentation of a bygone era and it will ad billions of pounds to the costs of travelling across Europe.

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By *uclid   profile verified by photo (M) 2 weeks ago

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As a truck driver myself ,having done UK and continental work ,I can't see any problems with the infrastructure that's in place ,just like banking and manufacturing .nothing should change .

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By *annyboy87  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"As a truck driver myself ,having done UK and continental work ,I can't see any problems with the infrastructure that's in place ,just like banking and manufacturing .nothing should change ."

No it maybe a good system now but you have to know that the EU are going to make it very difficult for us to do anything as they want to send out message to other EU countrys this is what you get if you dare leave

So things bound to change

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"As a truck driver myself ,having done UK and continental work ,I can't see any problems with the infrastructure that's in place ,just like banking and manufacturing .nothing should change .No it maybe a good system now but you have to know that the EU are going to make it very difficult for us to do anything as they want to send out message to other EU countrys this is what you get if you dare leave

So things bound to change "

It is not the fault of the EU that some of us decided to leave and they therefore have no obligation whatsoever to make things easy for us. Some of us made the choice and all of us will have to pay.

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By *abby60  (M) 2 weeks ago

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Can't wait !!

Short term pain, long term gain !

It might even make the snowflakes wake up, and pull their fingers out of their bloody arses!!

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 2 weeks ago

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"can someone please explain the logic behind awarding a £13.5 billion contract to use ferry's for extra crossing's in the event of a no deal on the brexit negotiations, to a brand new company with no ships at all ?

i know Grayling says he proud to support a new British business but there must be some sort of explanation"

All I can say on this subject at the moment is that it is 13.5 million not 13.5 billion. An easy mistake but a considerable difference.

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By *annyboy87  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"As a truck driver myself ,having done UK and continental work ,I can't see any problems with the infrastructure that's in place ,just like banking and manufacturing .nothing should change .No it maybe a good system now but you have to know that the EU are going to make it very difficult for us to do anything as they want to send out message to other EU countrys this is what you get if you dare leave

So things bound to change

It is not the fault of the EU that some of us decided to leave and they therefore have no obligation whatsoever to make things easy for us. Some of us made the choice and all of us will have to pay."

you right they don't have to make things easy

But the vote has passed now almost three years now, and remoaners just can't accept they lost vote, forever being negative, some in position to do things are even trying to. Sabotage it get over it

Like another member posted short term pain long term gain.

So remainers really need to shut up and start being positive

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By *annyboy87  (M) 2 weeks ago

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You remainers if you have to cry and blame anyone

Blame thes that didn't vote not the ones that did

I think you find that's around 30 million that didn't vote thatswhere blame should lie

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 2 weeks ago

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May well prove to be short-term gain (for the leavers constantly braying 'we won') and long-term pain (for everyone except the rich). We'll know in five to ten years time.

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 2 weeks ago

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"As a truck driver myself ,having done UK and continental work ,I can't see any problems with the infrastructure that's in place ,just like banking and manufacturing .nothing should change ."

You’re absolutely right. The present system works perfectly and has speeded up all the border crossings with one EU document to take you through but after we leave. The EU we won’t be able to use their membership document so will need separate documents at each and every border.

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By *annyboy87  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"May well prove to be short-term gain (for the leavers constantly braying 'we won') and long-term pain (for everyone except the rich). We'll know in five to ten years time."

why so negative

Like you have just said we know five to ten years so no one really knows just speculation.

Alot on here believe that Mrs may s deal is such a good deal even some that say they follow other parties

But some are negative over future can't have that much faith in Mrs may deal afterall can they

But the one that thinks she's out to sabotage exit (myself) is being positive over future

That may have something to do with Mrs may saying she step down after Brexit.

So something positive there to start with

We are England we have always been alright after a crisis and we will always be. Alright as long as there is positiveity

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 2 weeks ago

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Leaping into the unknown is bound to create worry and concern for the future. We know there will be many difficulties initially and not everyone has the confidence they will be sorted out.

Nobody believes any deal negotiated by the government will be a good one but we must support Mrs May in getting the best deal possible as that makes perfect sense.

So far Mrs May seems to be the only person in or out of government actually trying to do something positive so we should all be grateful for that at least.

I agree with Danny and we should support Mrs May in her positivity.

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 2 weeks ago

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I think those who voted leave should get on the ferries and leave. Then we could get some peace and quiet.

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By *annyboy87  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"I think those who voted leave should get on the ferries and leave. Then we could get some peace and quiet."

but it's the remoaners oops ment remainers that's making ripples with the constant negativity, doom mongering

So it's the remainers that should go for peace

Not only that the remainers want EU that much they should get ferry and go and live in EU then

Britain will be in a very peaceful place

It's about time we all accept result and be positive as there is already too much negativity in world

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 2 weeks ago

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Leaping into the unknown is bound to create worry and concern for the future. We know there will be many difficulties initially and not everyone has the confidence they will be sorted out.

Nobody believes any deal negotiated by the government will be a good one but we must support Mrs May in getting the best deal possible as that makes perfect sense.

So far Mrs May seems to be the only person in or out of government actually trying to do something positive so we should all be grateful for that at least.

I agree with Danny and we should support Mrs May in her positivity.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"I think those who voted leave should get on the ferries and leave. Then we could get some peace and quiet.but it's the remoaners oops ment remainers that's making ripples with the constant negativity, doom mongering

So it's the remainers that should go for peace

Not only that the remainers want EU that much they should get ferry and go and live in EU then

Britain will be in a very peaceful place

It's about time we all accept result and be positive as there is already too much negativity in world "

Being positive requires something to be positive about and we don't yet know if it is realistic to be positive about post-Brexit Britain. Hoping everyone will suddenly start supporting the leave cause is like expecting everyone to get behind Ms May because the has been elected and that is therefore the will of the people.

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By *annyboy87  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"I think those who voted leave should get on the ferries and leave. Then we could get some peace and quiet.but it's the remoaners oops ment remainers that's making ripples with the constant negativity, doom mongering

I

So it's the remainers that should go for peace

Not only that the remainers want EU that much they should get ferry and go and live in EU then

Britain will be in a very peaceful place

It's about time we all accept result and be positive as there is already too much negativity in world

Being positive requires something to be positive about and we don't yet know if it is realistic to be positive about post-Brexit Britain. Hoping everyone will suddenly start supporting the leave cause is like expecting everyone to get behind Ms May because the has been elected and that is therefore the will of the people."

I can understand why some can be negative especially with Mrs may at the helm

But all negativity seems to be coming from the remainers, the remainers are trying to infect everyone with they negativity.

You are right nothing to show to why should be positive, but same can be said with negativity.

Apart from the remainers scare mongering

The future is uncertain but still no need to be negative.

So let's all be positive

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 2 weeks ago

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Leaping into the unknown is bound to create worry and concern for the future. We know there will be many difficulties initially and not everyone has the confidence they will be sorted out.

Nobody believes any deal negotiated by the government will be a good one but we must support Mrs May in getting the best deal possible as that makes perfect sense.

So far Mrs May seems to be the only person in or out of government actually trying to do something positive so we should all be grateful for that at least.

I agree with Danny and we should support Mrs May in her positivity.

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By *abby60  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"My deal or no deal" - how is that meant to spread positivity, ffs?

Oh, and that was her second attempt at a deal ! - Both hated by all and sundry !

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By *antsbilad  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"So why is none British company getting lion share of British money "

Sadly no longer many British Shipping Companies out there who could be chartered to provide the ferries

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"I think those who voted leave should get on the ferries and leave. Then we could get some peace and quiet.but it's the remoaners oops ment remainers that's making ripples with the constant negativity, doom mongering

So it's the remainers that should go for peace

Not only that the remainers want EU that much they should get ferry and go and live in EU then

Britain will be in a very peaceful place

It's about time we all accept result and be positive as there is already too much negativity in world "

oh really? Accept the result and be positive because it went YOUR way even though it's a shit situation. We should all roll over and accept the will of 37% of the population on a non-binding vote that suddenly became binding.

It's YOUR decision to leave, be it on YOUR head.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"I think those who voted leave should get on the ferries and leave. Then we could get some peace and quiet.but it's the remoaners oops ment remainers that's making ripples with the constant negativity, doom mongering

So it's the remainers that should go for peace

Not only that the remainers want EU that much they should get ferry and go and live in EU then

Britain will be in a very peaceful place

It's about time we all accept result and be positive as there is already too much negativity in world

oh really? Accept the result and be positive because it went YOUR way even though it's a shit situation. We should all roll over and accept the will of 37% of the population on a non-binding vote that suddenly became binding.

It's YOUR decision to leave, be it on YOUR head. "

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 2 weeks ago

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""My deal or no deal" - how is that meant to spread positivity, ffs?

Oh, and that was her second attempt at a deal ! - Both hated by all and sundry !"

Positive or not that is the state of things. The EU, who obviously don't want us to leave since we are one of their leading cash=cows, are digging their well shod heels in and saying they will not negotiate a different deal. If, as seems quite likely, the Conservative Brexiteers and combined opposition parties vote down this deal then there is every chance we will leave in 85 days time with no deal. Two top government ministers have mentioned that we might try for a Norwegian or Canadian style arrangement. However neither of these are a complete break from the EU which the belligerent Brexiteers want. Another alternative, which is gaining popularity in the corridoes of Westminster, is a second referendum. Whether this would be a deal/no deal one or a repeat of the 2016 one would need to be decided if parliament went down that route.

It's all very well the likes of Jeremy Corbyn saying he would negotiate a better deal but he gives no indication of what he would aim for. Nor has he any experience of government, and has probably never had to negotiate anything more taxing than minor disputes in his constituency.

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By *annyboy87  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"I think those who voted leave should get on the ferries and leave. Then we could get some peace and quiet.but it's the remoaners oops ment remainers that's making ripples with the constant negativity, doom mongering

So it's the remainers that should go for peace

Not only that the remainers want EU that much they should get ferry and go and live in EU then

Britain will be in a very peaceful place

It's about time we all accept result and be positive as there is already too much negativity in world

oh really? Accept the result and be positive because it went YOUR way even though it's a shit situation. We should all roll over and accept the will of 37% of the population on a non-binding vote that suddenly became binding.

It's YOUR decision to leave, be it on YOUR head. "

see what I mean about remainers always being negative.

Throwing toys out because they didn't get what they wanted, stamping their feet it's not fair.

Yes only 37%voted so either aim your bile at those that didn't vote because you just could be jumping up and down laughing and screaming we won

Or just accept result like a men or women

Of course their is going to be a storm before calm we are England nothing will bring us down

We got over ww2 so we get through anything just have to have faith

And if any blame seriously as to be handed out look at those who did vote as it could have been a different story

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By *annyboy87  (M) 2 weeks ago

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""My deal or no deal" - how is that meant to spread positivity, ffs?

Oh, and that was her second attempt at a deal ! - Both hated by all and sundry !

Positive or not that is the state of things. The EU, who obviously don't want us to leave since we are one of their leading cash=cows, are digging their well shod heels in and saying they will not negotiate a different deal. If, as seems quite likely, the Conservative Brexiteers and combined opposition parties vote down this deal then there is every chance we will leave in 85 days time with no deal. Two top government ministers have mentioned that we might try for a Norwegian or Canadian style arrangement. However neither of these are a complete break from the EU which the belligerent Brexiteers want. Another alternative, which is gaining popularity in the corridoes of Westminster, is a second referendum. Whether this would be a deal/no deal one or a repeat of the 2016 one would need to be decided if parliament went down that route.

It's all very well the likes of Jeremy Corbyn saying he would negotiate a better deal but he gives no indication of what he would aim for. Nor has he any experience of government, and has probably never had to negotiate anything more taxing than minor disputes in his constituency."

Mr nk

I agree with most but

The vote was to leave EU and leave we should.

A second referendum should only be on deal not over we stay or leave.

EU don't want us to leave because of money they get of us. Once we have left that money can go to nhs and other services that need in our own country

It's about England looked after it self instead of spreading it all over.

If we look after number one our own in future we will be in a better position to care for others

Regarding Corbyn no he hasn't got experience of government but no one cansay for sure he would ffail

Just like many other pm all party's

Just look at Mrs may when she first become pm mistake after mistake some call these mistake as uturn same thing

Thank god she is not making as many mistakes now

So Corbyn just could have done better

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By *annyboy87  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"I think those who voted leave should get on the ferries and leave. Then we could get some peace and quiet.but it's the remoaners oops ment remainers that's making ripples with the constant negativity, doom mongering

So it's the remainers that should go for peace

Not only that the remainers want EU that much they should get ferry and go and live in EU then

Britain will be in a very peaceful place

It's about time we all accept result and be positive as there is already too much negativity in world

oh really? Accept the result and be positive because it went YOUR way even though it's a shit situation. We should all roll over and accept the will of 37% of the population on a non-binding vote that suddenly became binding.

It's YOUR decision to leave, be it on YOUR head. see what I mean about remainers always being negative.

Throwing toys out because they didn't get what they wanted, stamping their feet it's not fair.

Yes only 37%voted so either aim your bile at those that didn't vote because you just could be jumping up and down laughing and screaming we won

Or just accept result like a men or women

Of course their is going to be a storm before calm we are England nothing will bring us down

We got over ww2 so we get through anything just have to have faith

And if any blame seriously as to be handed out look at those who did vote as it could have been a different story "

those that didn't vote

That's what it meant to say

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 2 weeks ago

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"

Oh, and that was her second attempt at a deal ! - Both hated by all and sundry !"

I didn't comment on this in my previous post. Parliament appears to hate the deal mainly because the ardent Brexiteers among Conservative MPs want a no deal Brexit and the opposition will not support it, or grant a free vote, because they want to sabotage the deal and force a general election. The deal is actually quite popular amongst big business leaders, the small business community and the farming community, none of whom want to see a no-deal Brexit and all the uncertainty it most probably will bring.

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*Ybear By *Ybear  (M) 2 weeks ago

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Those groups who support the deal are remainers. The reason they like it is that it keeps us in the EU until a trade deal is agreed. The backstop arrangement comes into play if no deal is agreed within two years and we can’t get out of it unless the EU agree.

The French President has already said that if he doesn’t get his way on fisheries (I.e. access to U.K. waters as they have now) he will use his veto to prevent any deal and so keep us in the Customs Union unable to make outside deals.

If we give in to him just to get a deal we will have 26 other leaders making similar demands holding us to ransom.

This will leave us unable to make outside deals and still be subject to all the rules of the EU but have no say in them.

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By *annyboy87  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"Those groups who support the deal are remainers. The reason they like it is that it keeps us in the EU until a trade deal is agreed. The backstop arrangement comes into play if no deal is agreed within two years and we can’t get out of it unless the EU agree.

The French President has already said that if he doesn’t get his way on fisheries (I.e. access to U.K. waters as they have now) he will use his veto to prevent any deal and so keep us in the Customs Union unable to make outside deals.

If we give in to him just to get a deal we will have 26 other leaders making similar demands holding us to ransom.

This will leave us unable to make outside deals and still be subject to all the rules of the EU but have no say in them."

yes totally agree Mr bear

Mrs may has got plenty of people fooled part of her plan

Not only that it is probably Brexiteers making a stink as this lame arse deal Mrs. May as cooked up

Is obviously wrong deal probably means one foot in and one foot out of EU

That's not leaving

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 2 weeks ago

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"Those groups who support the deal are remainers. "

Not necessarily true. I voted to leave but I do not want to see a no deal Brexit and would much rather see this current proposed deal implemented. It's not perfect by a long way. I am not happy with the Irish backstop and I think the government need to explain the severance pay. I understand it to an extent but not fully. A lot of Remainers within the Conservative Party have reluctantly accepted this deal because they respect the result of the referendum but want to see the UK leave the EU as smoothly and as painlessly as possible.

I'm not a fan of the EU [note I don't say Europe] which is why I voted to leave. It is too bureaucratic and it has let far too many 2nd world counties in with their begging bowls and nothing to offer in return. However I do not want to see this country cast adrift with what could be a very uncertain and chaotic future if we have no deal in place.

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"can someone please explain the logic behind awarding a £13.5 billion contract to use ferry's for extra crossing's in the event of a no deal on the brexit negotiations, to a brand new company with no ships at all ?

i know Grayling says he proud to support a new British business but there must be some sort of explanation"

I had to laugh at the ‘terms and conditions’ of the new Ferry organisation that refers to takeaway food. It’s pathetic.

Just like the hasty codged together bullshit that was spouted at the start of this whole dirty brexit mess. Only the idiots swallowed that crock.

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By *annyboy87  (M) 2 weeks ago

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A lot of Remainers within the Conservative Party have reluctantly accepted this deal because they respect the result of the referendum but want to see the UK leave the EU as smoothly and as painlessly as possible

The remainers have quiten down as that lame deal means we still got one foot in EU

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 2 weeks ago

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"Those groups who support the deal are remainers.

Not necessarily true. I voted to leave but I do not want to see a no deal Brexit and would much rather see this current proposed deal implemented. It's not perfect by a long way. I am not happy with the Irish backstop and I think the government need to explain the severance pay. I understand it to an extent but not fully. A lot of Remainers within the Conservative Party have reluctantly accepted this deal because they respect the result of the referendum but want to see the UK leave the EU as smoothly and as painlessly as possible.

I'm not a fan of the EU [note I don't say Europe] which is why I voted to leave. It is too bureaucratic and it has let far too many 2nd world counties in with their begging bowls and nothing to offer in return. However I do not want to see this country cast adrift with what could be a very uncertain and chaotic future if we have no deal in place."

Spot on Nordic knight. Someone got their assessment very wrong. I’m another who voted leave but wouldn’t want to just jump ship with no plans. That seems very naive and very foolish.

The future is uncertain but if leaving was wrong then I hope you will join me in admitting we were wrong lol.

I’m pleased Mrs May is fighting so hard for a quick and decent Brexit.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 2 weeks ago

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If it all goes pear shaped I will admit I was wrong to vote leave. Despite a lifelong opposition to the EU I was in two minds as to which way I would vote in 2016. In the end it was a bit of a case of my heart over-ruling my head as I feared a long, protracted and messy divorce. If there was a repeat referendum, which I rather doubt, I would probably 'put on a pair of gloves' and vote to remain

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By *annyboy87  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"Those groups who support the deal are remainers.

Not necessarily true. I voted to leave but I do not want to see a no deal Brexit and would much rather see this current proposed deal implemented. It's not perfect by a long way. I am not happy with the Irish backstop and I think the government need to explain the severance pay. I understand it to an extent but not fully. A lot of Remainers within the Conservative Party have reluctantly accepted this deal because they respect the result of the referendum but want to see the UK leave the EU as smoothly and as painlessly as possible.

I'm not a fan of the EU [note I don't say Europe] which is why I voted to leave. It is too bureaucratic and it has let far too many 2nd world counties in with their begging bowls and nothing to offer in return. However I do not want to see this country cast adrift with what could be a very uncertain and chaotic future if we have no deal in place.

Spot on Nordic knight. Someone got their assessment very wrong. I’m another who voted leave but wouldn’t want to just jump ship with no plans. That seems very naive and very foolish.

The future is uncertain but if leaving was wrong then I hope you will join me in admitting we were wrong lol.

I’m pleased Mrs May is fighting so hard for a quick and decent Brexit. "

what makes you think Mrs may has a decent deal, because businesses say so

Biggest percentage of business I would want to stay in EU, the EU was too quick in accepting deal

Most probably suits them more than us, would imagine they would have put up a fight if not suited them

So is it a decent deal only time will tell

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"

A lot of Remainers within the Conservative Party have reluctantly accepted this deal because they respect the result of the referendum but want to see the UK leave the EU as smoothly and as painlessly as possible

The remainers have quiten down as that lame deal means we still got one foot in EU "

For me, the sooner we leave the better. I’m sick to the back teeth of the leavers going on about it. The sooner we start to suffer price rises, labour shortages and economic chaos the sooner we can deal with the real issues.

I don’t have to bother about getting a job - although there will be lots of ‘unfillable’ jobs around; there won’t be an unending pool of Eastern Europeans queuing to fill them any more.

Let’s hope the country survives with dignity - which is more than certain braying leavers have.

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By *aravaggio  (M) 2 weeks ago

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I think that dignity is the sole preserve of the leavers. Remainers appear to know no limits to the depths they will sink in order to chuck proverbial spanners in whatever works are handy. Its very dignified, isn't it, to want to cast aside your country in favour of being a "European" citizen? Does it not mean anything to you at all, that in a few years time, if the EU had its unhindered way, individual countries would cease to exist, other than as a federal state? Why do you think you are a mix of French and German? Do you seriously believe that you have the same mentality? If so, I suggest you go and live on mainland Europe, and let those of us who want to make a success of OUR country, get on with doing so.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 2 weeks ago

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I think there is very little dignity with either the adamant Leaver or Remainers. They are both as pg-headed as each other and both adopted this appalling 'Holier Than Thou' attitude. There have got to be some compromises along the way.

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 2 weeks ago

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I agree there has been little dignity. I speak to many in the business community who quietly and reasonably discuss opportunisties won or lost when we leave but online .. the very publicly vocal ones .. I hear nothing whatsoever. No plans. No ideas. Not even any logical reasons to stay or go..

A lot of blustering, cursing and rhetoric and that’s about it.

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By *aravaggio  (M) 2 weeks ago

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…. no logical reasons to stay or go?? I think the logic has been done to death on both sides, but each other's logic will never be anywhere close enough for compromise to take place.

The basic tenets for leaving were: Control of borders and hence movement of people and goods. You either have it or you don't, therefore no compromise possible. Ability to govern ourselves under our own laws. You either have it or you don't, therefore no compromise possible. The ability to trade with whom we like. You either have it or you don't, therefore no compromise possible. Compromise on any of those three items, and we find ourselves entrapped still within the grasp of the EU, which is not what was voted for.

Regular readers may remember that as soon as article 50 was passed as law, I said that a no-deal brexit would happen. Nothing else was ever remotely on the cards. The EU would not give us an inch as that would set a precedent for other disgruntled members. I cannot believe that any politician worth their salt seriously believed otherwise, unless they were in the remain camp and were happy to go against the democratic will of the people. You only have to look at the Labour stance on the matter to realise that they are only acting out the "opposition view". Everything they have said on Brexit has been meaningless, or at best, available for twisting to a different meaning. No-deal is going to happen, and its at that point, when we are out of the EU's clutches, without paying them a penny, that we put in place our deals with countries, not with an amorphous bureaucratic mass, whose inhabitants are in reality, just as disgruntled as we are.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"I agree there has been little dignity. I speak to many in the business community who quietly and reasonably discuss opportunisties won or lost when we leave but online .. the very publicly vocal ones .. I hear nothing whatsoever. No plans. No ideas. Not even any logical reasons to stay or go..

A lot of blustering, cursing and rhetoric and that’s about it. "

I agree, and the previous post just confirms this view with bombastic rhetoric.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 2 weeks ago

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"Control of borders and hence people and good"

Sorry to say it Mr C but that is the 'cake'n eat it' mantra of the ardent Brexiteers. Ideally that maybe what we would like and maybe what a lot of Leavers, myself included, voted for. However in order to achieve this you need some kind of agreement otherwise you may restrict the flow of people but you may also restrict the flow of goods.

It might come right in the end but we could end up with several months of shortages of things we need, stock-piling of things we need to export, employment lay-offs, even if temporary; and general chaos. A 'no-deal' Brexit is fraught with uncertainty however desirable it may seem.

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By *annyboy87  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"

A lot of Remainers within the Conservative Party have reluctantly accepted this deal because they respect the result of the referendum but want to see the UK leave the EU as smoothly and as painlessly as possible

The remainers have quiten down as that lame deal means we still got one foot in EU

For me, the sooner we leave the better. I’m sick to the back teeth of the leavers going on about it. The sooner we start to suffer price rises, labour shortages and economic chaos the sooner we can deal with the real issues.

I don’t have to bother about getting a job - although there will be lots of ‘unfillable’ jobs around; there won’t be an unending pool of Eastern Europeans queuing to fill them any more.

Let’s hope the country survives with dignity - which is more than certain braying leavers have."

there's a solution to lots of unfillable jobs make the lazy dozens on benefits take them or stop they money.

It brings unemployment down at same time something tories struggle to do.

And March 29 can't come quick enough stop certain remainers spreading their negative bile

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By *annyboy87  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"I think that dignity is the sole preserve of the leavers. Remainers appear to know no limits to the depths they will sink in order to chuck proverbial spanners in whatever works are handy. Its very dignified, isn't it, to want to cast aside your country in favour of being a "European" citizen? Does it not mean anything to you at all, that in a few years time, if the EU had its unhindered way, individual countries would cease to exist, other than as a federal state? Why do you think you are a mix of French and German? Do you seriously believe that you have the same mentality? If so, I suggest you go and live on mainland Europe, and let those of us who want to make a success of OUR country, get on with doing so. "

very well said Mr C

Why is they so such trouble with in government because the (losers)remainers just can't stop trying to sabotage the exit. And spreading they bile

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 2 weeks ago

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March will come quickly enough and if it's no deal chaos we will be able to hold leave voters accountable and see what facts they can offer to make us all feel positive about the land of milk and honey ahead of us at some time in the distant future.

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By *abby60  (M) 2 weeks ago

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I don't imagine things ran smoothly when we first joined, either. There are potential hazards in everything we do, every day.

No deal, will just be one of our BIGGER obstacles. So the sooner they get on with it, the sooner we'll come through it.

I'm sure most of us agree that if the councils, or government have got anything to do with it, it will take a dozen times longer than it would take anyone else ! Unless YOU owe THEM money, of course !!

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"I think that dignity is the sole preserve of the leavers. Remainers appear to know no limits to the depths they will sink in order to chuck proverbial spanners in whatever works are handy. Its very dignified, isn't it, to want to cast aside your country in favour of being a "European" citizen? Does it not mean anything to you at all, that in a few years time, if the EU had its unhindered way, individual countries would cease to exist, other than as a federal state? Why do you think you are a mix of French and German? Do you seriously believe that you have the same mentality? If so, I suggest you go and live on mainland Europe, and let those of us who want to make a success of OUR country, get on with doing so. "

Some of the leavers on here wouldn't know what dignity was if they tripped over it. I have a great deal of respect for some people who can construct a valid argument and opposing point rather than just braying and I don't mind deferring to an opposing point on it's own merit.

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By *annyboy87  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"I don't imagine things ran smoothly when we first joined, either. There are potential hazards in everything we do, every day.

No deal, will just be one of our BIGGER obstacles. So the sooner they get on with it, the sooner we'll come through it.

I'm sure most of us agree that if the councils, or government have got anything to do with it, it will take a dozen times longer than it would take anyone else ! Unless YOU owe THEM money, of course !! "

very well said nice to see some positiveity for once

Instead of negative bile that is going around

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"I think that dignity is the sole preserve of the leavers. Remainers appear to know no limits to the depths they will sink in order to chuck proverbial spanners in whatever works are handy. Its very dignified, isn't it, to want to cast aside your country in favour of being a "European" citizen? Does it not mean anything to you at all, that in a few years time, if the EU had its unhindered way, individual countries would cease to exist, other than as a federal state? Why do you think you are a mix of French and German? Do you seriously believe that you have the same mentality? If so, I suggest you go and live on mainland Europe, and let those of us who want to make a success of OUR country, get on with doing so. very well said Mr C

Why is they so such trouble with in government because the (losers)remainers just can't stop trying to sabotage the exit. And spreading they bile"

I can't really understand what the hell you're going on about except that you are making disparaging comments again and piggy backing on a valid point made by someone else.

This is not a personal attack, just an observation.

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By *abby60  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"I think that dignity is the sole preserve of the leavers. Remainers appear to know no limits to the depths they will sink in order to chuck proverbial spanners in whatever works are handy. Its very dignified, isn't it, to want to cast aside your country in favour of being a "European" citizen? Does it not mean anything to you at all, that in a few years time, if the EU had its unhindered way, individual countries would cease to exist, other than as a federal state? Why do you think you are a mix of French and German? Do you seriously believe that you have the same mentality? If so, I suggest you go and live on mainland Europe, and let those of us who want to make a success of OUR country, get on with doing so. "

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"I don't imagine things ran smoothly when we first joined, either. There are potential hazards in everything we do, every day.

No deal, will just be one of our BIGGER obstacles. So the sooner they get on with it, the sooner we'll come through it.

I'm sure most of us agree that if the councils, or government have got anything to do with it, it will take a dozen times longer than it would take anyone else ! Unless YOU owe THEM money, of course !! very well said nice to see some positiveity for once

Instead of negative bile that is going around "

and again

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By *annyboy87  (M) 2 weeks ago

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You just make me laugh Mr Cheshire I won't bite wasting your time

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 2 weeks ago

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"

It brings unemployment down at same time something tories struggle to do. "

Just for the record unemployment is the lowest it has been for about 40 years. And before you start screaming about part-time jobs, zero contracts, students etc etc. This is an independent statistic as all governments of whatever hue can 'massage' figures to suit there own agenda.

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By *annyboy87  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"

It brings unemployment down at same time something tories struggle to do.

Just for the record unemployment is the lowest it has been for about 40 years. And before you start screaming about part-time jobs, zero contracts, students etc etc. This is an independent statistic as all governments of whatever hue can 'massage' figures to suit there own agenda."

you are most probably massaged

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 2 weeks ago

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Sorry Danny but I haven't had a massage since I retires from playing rugby. 14 years this April

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By *annyboy87  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"Sorry Danny but I haven't had a massage since I retires from playing rugby. 14 years this April "

you ought to get one release all tension, everyone has tension.

My post was meant to the figures have been massaged

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 2 weeks ago

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"Sorry Danny but I haven't had a massage since I retires from playing rugby. 14 years this April you ought to get one release all tension, everyone has tension.

My post was meant to the figures have been massaged "

Perhaps you should have a nice massage. Help release all that pent up aggression you have regarding Mrs May and the Conservatives

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By *annyboy87  (M) 2 weeks ago

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"Sorry Danny but I haven't had a massage since I retires from playing rugby. 14 years this April you ought to get one release all tension, everyone has tension.

My post was meant to the figures have been massaged

Perhaps you should have a nice massage. Help release all that pent up aggression you have regarding Mrs May and the Conservatives "

my wife gives me one regular.

And you very well know that Mrs may and conservatives massage figures to make themselves look good. They all do it all parties

Don't know why some don't think Mrs may doesn't

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 2 weeks ago

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Of course you are right Danny. All parties “massage” statistics although there is nothing inherently wrong with that. They don’t have to lie or even exaggerate as it is easy to present statistics however you want and all parties, companies, councils and other entities have always done so.

I don’t think party leaders get too involved with such detail it would be those employed to work with the statistic.

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