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NO BREXIT ?

By *illanihole  (M) 14 weeks ago

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Has anyone else noticed Mrs May has said on a couple of occasions "NO BREXIT" this has also been said a few times by ministers in parliament. Watching the statement from strasbourg by the pm and Junker tonight it was heard once more but not from the PM. Mr Junker said it this time! Be interesting to watch the votes over the next day or so, maybe theres a new stop brexit plan being hatched ? Surely not I hear you say, then why has it been said? freudian slip or a nasty undercurrent.

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By *oondog   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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Mrs May has said consistently throughout this process that there is a real possibility of there being no Brexit at all if her deal is voted down.

Yes it is a reminder of the threat a group of MPs dedicated to overturning Brexit exists and are working to bring that about.

There's a real chance of that happening and Mrs May has been very open about it.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 14 weeks ago

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There is a danger of No Brexit and ironically it could be brought about by the most ardent and bone-headed Brexiteers themselves. If they vote down the deal tonight there will be two more votes over the next two days. One ill be to take No Deal off the table which may well succeed as the chances are there will be a majority in the HOC who oppose a No Deal Brexit. Then there will be a vote to extend Article 50 which again will probably get a majority in its favour. Then what? More negotiations which could go on forever and Article 50 could get extended ad infinitum.

Perhaps in the end [God forbid] another referendum will be the only answer. More scaremongering and more distortions of the truth from both sides, and an unpredictable result.

In the event of another referendum it would be interesting as to what question gets asked. Get it wrong and this process could go on forever.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 14 weeks ago

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Trouble at this late stage is that it is all speculation as absolutely nobody knows what is happening or going to happen. We MIGHT know more by 29 March but the way St Theresa is acting there is no guarantee of even that.

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By *oondog   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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I think you're right NK Brexit is at risk primarily through the actions of Brexiteers.

The only sense of a majority in HOC is against no deal and many, including cabinet ministers are poised to rule that out.

There is no sense of a majority for anything else and a small group of MPs are saying all they need to stop Brexit is a vote for a delay. It's going to be an interesting day!

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By *aravaggio  (M) 14 weeks ago

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If Brexit doesn't occur, I would like to think there would be insurrection …… but we're British, so there won't be, and the despicable creatures that inhabit the Palace of Westminster will continue to take the piss out of the people who put them on the gravy train in the first place. Irrespective of how you voted in the referendum, do any of these shenanigans make any sense or contain any logic as to how an elected parliament should behave?

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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I would wager a considerable amount ( if I had it. ) that in two years time, whether in or out of the EU, the arguments will continue in much the same way as they are now. With the country split down the middle and then into smaller factions whichever courses we take most will be unhappy.

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By *awtyCawty  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"If Brexit doesn't occur, I would like to think there would be insurrection …… but we're British, so there won't be, and the despicable creatures that inhabit the Palace of Westminster will continue to take the piss out of the people who put them on the gravy train in the first place. Irrespective of how you voted in the referendum, do any of these shenanigans make any sense or contain any logic as to how an elected parliament should behave? "

Every single last one of them is voting it down for their own interests, they couldn’t give a shit about the people. The elite remainers are doing it for financial reasons and their own interests, the Corbynator and his Labour scum are doing it because they want another election which they don’t have a hope in hell of winning, and the rest of them are doing it because they know if we come out of the EU they will have to finally do some fucking work and run the country instead of falling back on the EU all the time.

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By *ister Pfister   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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"If Brexit doesn't occur, I would like to think there would be insurrection …… "

You're not the only one there


"but we're British, so there won't be"

I wouldn't hold my breath on that!

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By *otts63bi  (M) 14 weeks ago

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its obvious they dont give a fuck about democracy

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 14 weeks ago

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"If Brexit doesn't occur, I would like to think there would be insurrection …… but we're British, so there won't be, "

If Brexit doesn't happen I will be annoyed--well quite pissed off really. However I wont even try to do anything about it. The whole vexed subject has dominated the news for the last 3 years or more but, if it doesn't happen, it is not going to make that much difference. Life will go on. It is not as if we will suddenly be financially worse off or compelled to wear poker-dot shell suits and made to worship gilt statues of Juncker and Barnier three times a day.

Of course there will be demonstrations like there are at the moment outside the Palace of Westminster, but most of us will just want to get on with our lives and quite rightly too.

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By (user no longer on site) 14 weeks ago

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"If Brexit doesn't occur, I would like to think there would be insurrection …… but we're British, so there won't be,

If Brexit doesn't happen I will be annoyed--well quite pissed off really. However I wont even try to do anything about it. The whole vexed subject has dominated the news for the last 3 years or more but, if it doesn't happen, it is not going to make that much difference. Life will go on. It is not as if we will suddenly be financially worse off or compelled to wear poker-dot shell suits and made to worship gilt statues of Juncker and Barnier three times a day.

Of course there will be demonstrations like there are at the moment outside the Palace of Westminster, but most of us will just want to get on with our lives and quite rightly too."

Trouble with that is,- if we let the dishonest twats walk all over us on this, they'll think they can do it whenever it suits them.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 14 weeks ago

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There is a saying that one definition of insanity is doing the same thing repeatedly and hoping for a different outcome. If that is true, I wonder what it tells us about Ms May. Looks like another defeat this evening, so when will she present the same deal for a third time?

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*hris51234 By  *hris51234    profile verified by photo premium paying member (M) 14 weeks ago

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Whatever was decided between May and Juncker Yesterday reguarding the 'backstop' according to Attorney General Geoffrey Cox QC, is NOT legally binding and so the legal risk remains the same, therefore i would suggest the deal will once again be voted down later today, could we now be heading for a no deal Brexit?

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By *oondog   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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That's not strictly true.

The five page document has the same legal status as both the other documents and that is clearly stated in it if you've taken the time to read it.

The deal was always going to be the same it's the legal interpretations that have changed.

Geoffrey Cox will tell parliament later today that it does offer a way out and is not a permanent imprisonment in the backstop.

All the unqualified lawyers in various newsrooms and parties will have their largely non-professional say and there will be chaos.

The deal will be voted down, Bercow will allow an amendment that makes no deal unlawful and that will be pretty much the end of Brexit.

The HOC will have bitten off its nose to spite it's face!

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By *orum reader  (M) 14 weeks ago

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Personally I don't think Parliament will allow "no deal" to happen

Where exactly that leaves us after the votes this week I have no idea and I'm not sure anyone else does either

There would have to be an extension but of course if the EU says no the we do leave with no deal

I have a headache now

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By (user no longer on site) 14 weeks ago

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"Whatever was decided between May and Juncker Yesterday reguarding the 'backstop' according to Attorney General Geoffrey Cox QC, is NOT legally binding and so the legal risk remains the same, therefore i would suggest the deal will once again be voted down later today, could we now be heading for a no deal Brexit?"

I for one, am praying for 'no deal'!

This country needs to fuckin grow a pair.

And let's not forget,- we are overdue a recession anyway.-(Before the remoaners start talking of pending chaos and doom).

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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That is daisy mays target from very start to achieve a no brexit.

Some who wear blinkers when it comes to they beloved Mrs may are always saying she is doing her best and doing a great job

Yes she is a great job of fucking brexit up

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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I think she is trying hard and doing as good a job under the circumstances as could be reasonably expected.

If it was a case of 100% of the country wanting Brexit with no deals whatsoever then she would be doing a bad job but that isn’t the case.

Whichever leader or party had to deal with Brexit they are there to try and bring some satisfaction to all the population - not just 50% and also the overriding concern must be for the good of the country as a whole and the welfare of 100% of the population even if that means than no one is completely satisfied.

Some who voted for Brexit admit they want to leave regardless of any circumstances even if it is damaging but. That is not a stance any government can take.

Simply insulting Mrs May is not a stance but a bit of self indulgence. I cannot stand Mr Corbyn but I don’t just insult him at every opportunity and I never ever join in the playground behaviour of calling him names or making up names for him - he is Mr Corbyn.

I would be very interested to know what sone posters actually think of Brexit policies and how the economy might shape up in the future but some of the most prolific posters offer no new ideas on the subject.

I don’t particularly like or dislike Mrs May but I do believe she has done well and as someone else said - it is the Brexiteers who are doing the most harm and preventing a reasonable deal where we can leave the EU and move on.

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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Yes they are brexiteers having they say and doing other stuff too, but there is also remainers wanting second referendum.

But Mrs may hasn't budged one bit as she has her own agenda

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 14 weeks ago

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"I think she is trying hard and doing as good a job under the circumstances as could be reasonably expected.

If it was a case of 100% of the country wanting Brexit with no deals whatsoever then she would be doing a bad job but that isn’t the case.

Whichever leader or party had to deal with Brexit they are there to try and bring some satisfaction to all the population - not just 50% and also the overriding concern must be for the good of the country as a whole and the welfare of 100% of the population even if that means than no one is completely satisfied.

Some who voted for Brexit admit they want to leave regardless of any circumstances even if it is damaging but. That is not a stance any government can take.

Simply insulting Mrs May is not a stance but a bit of self indulgence. I cannot stand Mr Corbyn but I don’t just insult him at every opportunity and I never ever join in the playground behaviour of calling him names or making up names for him - he is Mr Corbyn.

I would be very interested to know what sone posters actually think of Brexit policies and how the economy might shape up in the future but some of the most prolific posters offer no new ideas on the subject.

I don’t particularly like or dislike Mrs May but I do believe she has done well and as someone else said - it is the Brexiteers who are doing the most harm and preventing a reasonable deal where we can leave the EU and move on."

At last a sensible and well thought out post.

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Simply insulting Mrs May is not a stance but a bit of self indulgence. I cannot stand Mr Corbyn but I don’t just insult him at every opportunity and I never ever join in the playground behaviour of calling him names or making up names for him - he is Mr Corbyn."

Never insulted Mr Corbyn, never called him names don't think so.

Go and read through some old threads,

But you take every opportunity to question people's intelligence and pull them down at every opportunity.

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By *aravaggio  (M) 14 weeks ago

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The problem with Brexit, is that if it is to be what was voted for, it HAS to be a no deal Brexit. The project fear merchants have scuppered the whole thing, with their talk of "crashing" out with no deal. Don't forget, whilst most of us despise politicians, they are very good with words, and very good at implanting seeds of ideas into the minds of the moronic masses and allowing them to germinate with a nudge here and a prod there. I keep repeating, NOBODY, but NOBODY knows what life after Brexit will be like. The EU were never going to give us a deal, as they didn't want us to leave. Only after we have left will they start to talk sensibly about trade deals. ……. Why can't people see the logic behind it all? Its beyond me!

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 14 weeks ago

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You are right Mr C in that nobody does know what things are going to like after Brexit. I'm neither taken in by the prophet of doom or those who look through their rose tinted spectacles.

What I don't agree is that all of us who voted for Brexit in fact voted for a no deal one. I certainly did not. Perhaps I should have listened to all the debates and read all the articles on the subject. No deal was something UKIP put forward but not the more moderate Brexiteers. As far as I am concerned there was always going to be a smooth withdrawal with minimum drama or disruption.

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"You are right Mr C in that nobody does know what things are going to like after Brexit. I'm neither taken in by the prophet of doom or those who look through their rose tinted spectacles.

What I don't agree is that all of us who voted for Brexit in fact voted for a no deal one. I certainly did not. Perhaps I should have listened to all the debates and read all the articles on the subject. No deal was something UKIP put forward but not the more moderate Brexiteers. As far as I am concerned there was always going to be a smooth withdrawal with minimum drama or disruption."

I'm with you here Mr nk I voted leave but wasn't for a no deal exit

Even though if it meant leaving without one I'd except that. But we do need an deal but an good one not just any deal

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By *oondog   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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I think most people thought there would be an orderly withdrawal with the basics covered.

No-one wants the tourist trade wrecked in some European cities or to have their leisure travel significantly curtailed.

Most people I think would have wanted the flow of fresh produce to and from Europe to continue.

Eurostar, Eurotunnel and the ferries and airlines were still expected to operate.

Free movement I expected to end along with the jurisdiction of the European Court and the UK free to make its own laws and trade deals. Payments to the EU I expected to tail off except for individual agreements where we still wanted to take part.

Most of the people I talk to had the same expectations so I think that assumes some sort of a deal.

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By *oondog   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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Just to be clear I don't fear a no-deal Brexit.

I don't think it will be allowed to happen but I do believe if it did there may be some short-term disruption but we'd recover and make a success of it.

We need to get on with it and move to the next stage.

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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""Simply insulting Mrs May is not a stance but a bit of self indulgence. I cannot stand Mr Corbyn but I don’t just insult him at every opportunity and I never ever join in the playground behaviour of calling him names or making up names for him - he is Mr Corbyn."

Never insulted Mr Corbyn, never called him names don't think so.

Go and read through some old threads,

But you take every opportunity to question people's intelligence and pull them down at every opportunity. "

OMG you are referring to my post lol. Read again please and feel free to look at every one of my posts.

a) I have criticised Mr Corbyn's actions both past and present and with good reason (imo) but I have never insulted him or sunk to name calling.

b) I have never questioned anyone's intelligence on here. I may have generalised and said some posts show some thought and are more intelligent than others but how could I possibly question the intelligence of a poster I don't know? Not my style.

If you have a complex it certainly has nothing to do with me or my posts and i only refer to you personally here because you singled out my remarks and made untrue insinuations about me.

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By *ollydee   premium paying member (M) 14 weeks ago

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The EU. have done their best to prevent us leaving at every turn, the EU. are scared it may trigger referendums in other EU. countries, the EU. is failing badly, and if Mrs May does get defeated it will be a feather in the cap for Corbyn and although I have no time for Rees-Mogg he stated yesterday a defeat would pave the way for a labour Government, I vote labour but do not want that man Corbynin charge of this country as PM.

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By *hemaligfreund   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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Perhaps if anyone can come up with a clear explanation of how we will be better off out of the EU, that might help. So far, the enemy have offered nothing but lies. If the government were elected by PR not FPTP we would have a more representative sample of representatives as well.

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By *oondog   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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Anyway, the fun starts at 6pm on BBC news channel with three hours of coverage on the Brexit Deal votes.

I will be glued to the screen as we watch history happen.

MPs will either piss away the only real chance of moving on or they'll grasp the nettle and approve something.

As expected, the press are all reporting widespread disapproval but I'm told at the House there are genuine attempts to understand what guarantees the new documentation offers before ruling it out. People who you would expect to be in the know say the Labour party cannot decide which way to go or how to handle people who disobey the whip (which is not yet defined!)

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By (user no longer on site) 14 weeks ago

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"Perhaps if anyone can come up with a clear explanation of how we will be better off out of the EU, that might help. So far, the enemy have offered nothing but lies. If the government were elected by PR not FPTP we would have a more representative sample of representatives as well."

Perhaps YOU, could come up with a clear explanation of why we are better off IN the eu?

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Perhaps if anyone can come up with a clear explanation of how we will be better off out of the EU, that might help. So far, the enemy have offered nothing but lies. If the government were elected by PR not FPTP we would have a more representative sample of representatives as well.

Perhaps YOU, could come up with a clear explanation of why we are better off IN the eu? "

To be fair we already know exactly what it is like to be in the EU so no further explanations are needed but I have asked many times for actual well defined and explained reasons why we might be better off leaving.

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Perhaps if anyone can come up with a clear explanation of how we will be better off out of the EU, that might help. So far, the enemy have offered nothing but lies. If the government were elected by PR not FPTP we would have a more representative sample of representatives as well.

Perhaps YOU, could come up with a clear explanation of why we are better off IN the eu? "

can't wait for answer but won't hold breath

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By *illanihole  (M) 14 weeks ago

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Problem with leaving on a no deal basis is that no one in govt or the business side has had the oppertunity to spread the word on how many benefits could arise. All the media have taken up a project fear stance simply because thats the way to blind the public into thinking its all bad.

Little airtime has been given to those that have good ideas and have already put in place arrangements that can make a no deal scenario look good and actually work. The remain lobby have worked things through to stop us leaving from the start.

All the doom and gloom has been spread about leaving with so very little said about how good things can be once the shackles of the EU have been broken.

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By *orum reader  (M) 14 weeks ago

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After tonight's defeat where dies Mrs May go now

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*hris51234 By  *hris51234    profile verified by photo premium paying member (M) 14 weeks ago

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Vote tomorrow on if we should leave on no deal if not vote Thursday to extend article 50

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Problem with leaving on a no deal basis is that no one in govt or the business side has had the oppertunity to spread the word on how many benefits could arise. All the media have taken up a project fear stance simply because thats the way to blind the public into thinking its all bad.

Little airtime has been given to those that have good ideas and have already put in place arrangements that can make a no deal scenario look good and actually work. The remain lobby have worked things through to stop us leaving from the start.

All the doom and gloom has been spread about leaving with so very little said about how good things can be once the shackles of the EU have been broken.

"

the remainers won't let the good inside of leaving get shown to public

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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When is Mrs Theresa May see that big parts of her deal is just not good enough.

And if Mrs Theresa May hasn't got an agenda to mess brexit up.

When is she going do something about it, instead of just trying to get her way by running clock down

Its obvious she has no idea what she's doing. In other words out of her depth

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*ndyhants1 By *ndyhants1  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"When is Mrs Theresa May see that big parts of her deal is just not good enough.

And if Mrs Theresa May hasn't got an agenda to mess brexit up.

When is she going do something about it, instead of just trying to get her way by running clock down

Its obvious she has no idea what she's doing. In other words out of her depth"

How easy it is to quote all the things you hear others say on the news etc. Its Jeremy Corbyn who seems to have no idea, and has called again for a General Election ( that he would lose ), showing that he is not interested in the nest for the country just himself and his lefty lout friends

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"When is Mrs Theresa May see that big parts of her deal is just not good enough.

And if Mrs Theresa May hasn't got an agenda to mess brexit up.

When is she going do something about it, instead of just trying to get her way by running clock down

Its obvious she has no idea what she's doing. In other words out of her depth

How easy it is to quote all the things you hear others say on the news etc. Its Jeremy Corbyn who seems to have no idea, and has called again for a General Election ( that he would lose ), showing that he is not interested in the nest for the country just himself and his lefty lout friends"

funny that I haven't seen no television for two days now

So how I'm just quoteing what others are saying is madness

Unless I'm not the only one with those thoughts

Everything you have just said about muppet Corbyn can also be aimed at Mrs Theresa May.

By the way aiming insults or anything else my way about labour just gives me a. Good laugh as I'm not a Labour voter, even though conservative party are slowly dropping themselves down to labour s level lol

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By *cousedpw   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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" Vote tomorrow on if we should leave on no deal if not vote Thursday to extend article 50"

The big question is, if the EU agree to an extension, for how long? The European elections are due in May, if it goes past then we will have to field candidates.

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*hris51234 By  *hris51234    profile verified by photo premium paying member (M) 14 weeks ago

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" Vote tomorrow on if we should leave on no deal if not vote Thursday to extend article 50

The big question is, if the EU agree to an extension, for how long? The European elections are due in May, if it goes past then we will have to field candidates."

If i understood it correctly the EU would want a valid reason for wanting it extended and they probably won't see parliament not agreeing on it as a reason, however that would put the EU in a difficult position as that would mean leaving no deal on 29th if nothing is agreed either way i don't think they would be willing to extend long term.

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*oredEric By *oredEric  (M) 14 weeks ago

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Charges of treason should be brought against all 650 members of Parliament. Their job is to deliver the will of the people, they've worked against that totally. Right or wrong we decided, the job of MPs to deliver, they've done the opposite and are quite proud of their actions. We need to replace the lot of them.

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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"When is Mrs Theresa May see that big parts of her deal is just not good enough.

And if Mrs Theresa May hasn't got an agenda to mess brexit up.

When is she going do something about it, instead of just trying to get her way by running clock down

Its obvious she has no idea what she's doing. In other words out of her depth

How easy it is to quote all the things you hear others say on the news etc. Its Jeremy Corbyn who seems to have no idea, and has called again for a General Election ( that he would lose ), showing that he is not interested in the nest for the country just himself and his lefty lout friends"

It doesn’t really matter that Corbyn doesn’t have a clue because just like you and me and everyone else not in government .. he doesn’t need to have a clue.

I think May has always known what she wants and what she believes best for the country but has no bargaining power because her own party are as split as the rest of the country. A leader can only lead those who are willing to be led .. no matter who the leader is.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 14 weeks ago

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Well the hard line Brexiteers have really shot themselves in the foot now. Chances are a 'no deal' will get kicked out tomorrow then and extension is inevitable. A dreaded 2nd referendum is looking more likely by the day and that will probably be the end of Brexit completely.

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Well the hard line Brexiteers have really shot themselves in the foot now. Chances are a 'no deal' will get kicked out tomorrow then and extension is inevitable. A dreaded 2nd referendum is looking more likely by the day and that will probably be the end of Brexit completely."

yes the dreaded second referendum is looking very likely now

The remainers will be happy about that but that be brexiteers fault too I suppose

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By *iwmwales  (M) 14 weeks ago

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Tomorrow will be interesting, which Lobby will May walk through, leave with no deal or rule out no deal.

In fact the names of who voted for which should be an interesting read for their voters....

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"When is Mrs Theresa May see that big parts of her deal is just not good enough.

And if Mrs Theresa May hasn't got an agenda to mess brexit up.

When is she going do something about it, instead of just trying to get her way by running clock down

Its obvious she has no idea what she's doing. In other words out of her depth

How easy it is to quote all the things you hear others say on the news etc. Its Jeremy Corbyn who seems to have no idea, and has called again for a General Election ( that he would lose ), showing that he is not interested in the nest for the country just himself and his lefty lout friends

It doesn’t really matter that Corbyn doesn’t have a clue because just like you and me and everyone else not in government .. he doesn’t need to have a clue.

I think May has always known what she wants and what she believes best for the country but has no bargaining power because her own party are as split as the rest of the country. A leader can only lead those who are willing to be led .. no matter who the leader is. "

so we can't blame Corbyn for Brexit mess then that's ashamed well we now know who to blame lol

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Tomorrow will be interesting, which Lobby will May walk through, leave with no deal or rule out no deal.

In fact the names of who voted for which should be an interesting read for their voters.... "

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Well the hard line Brexiteers have really shot themselves in the foot now. Chances are a 'no deal' will get kicked out tomorrow then and extension is inevitable. A dreaded 2nd referendum is looking more likely by the day and that will probably be the end of Brexit completely."

Here's hoping. May and her bunch had their chance and made a hash of it.

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By *orum reader  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Tomorrow will be interesting, which Lobby will May walk through, leave with no deal or rule out no deal.

In fact the names of who voted for which should be an interesting read for their voters.... "

It is believed she will vote to rule out "no deal"

But we will find out tomorrow

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By *iwmwales  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Tomorrow will be interesting, which Lobby will May walk through, leave with no deal or rule out no deal.

In fact the names of who voted for which should be an interesting read for their voters....

It is believed she will vote to rule out "no deal"

But we will find out tomorrow "

If she votes against no deal, then we know that hers was a scam to "trap" us in the EU.

My bet - abstention...

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Tomorrow will be interesting, which Lobby will May walk through, leave with no deal or rule out no deal.

In fact the names of who voted for which should be an interesting read for their voters....

It is believed she will vote to rule out "no deal"

But we will find out tomorrow

If she votes against no deal, then we know that hers was a scam to "trap" us in the EU.

My bet - abstention..."

well said I've said all along Mrs Theresa May as an agenda

But her loyal fan club says different but that's their opinion

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 14 weeks ago

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Of course Mrs May has an agenda. That agenda is to take us out of the EU with the least amount of damage and disruption as possible. Her agenda has been thwarted by the hard-line brexiteers in her own party and the sheer bloody-mindedness of the combined opposition parties who are putting their own parties and political ambition before the good of the country. Anyone with any commonsense can see that but commonsense is a commodity in very short supply.

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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"When is Mrs Theresa May see that big parts of her deal is just not good enough.

And if Mrs Theresa May hasn't got an agenda to mess brexit up.

When is she going do something about it, instead of just trying to get her way by running clock down

Its obvious she has no idea what she's doing. In other words out of her depth

How easy it is to quote all the things you hear others say on the news etc. Its Jeremy Corbyn who seems to have no idea, and has called again for a General Election ( that he would lose ), showing that he is not interested in the nest for the country just himself and his lefty lout friends

It doesn’t really matter that Corbyn doesn’t have a clue because just like you and me and everyone else not in government .. he doesn’t need to have a clue.

I think May has always known what she wants and what she believes best for the country but has no bargaining power because her own party are as split as the rest of the country. A leader can only lead those who are willing to be led .. no matter who the leader is. so we can't blame Corbyn for Brexit mess then that's ashamed well we now know who to blame lol"

I haven’t seen anyone of any party blame Corbyn for Brexit .. it’s only recently he has popped his head above the parapet lol.

I suppose almost everyone is complicit in the catastrophe due to voting, being ignorant, being obstructive, and a lot of other reasons. However it has never benefited anyone when fingers are pointed .. I’d rather see some constructive ideas of how to get out of the mess.

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By *cousedpw   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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Jacob Rees Mogg made an interesting point tonight, 52% of voters wanted to leave the EU, but the vast majority of MP's want to remain. That is the crux of the matter.

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"When is Mrs Theresa May see that big parts of her deal is just not good enough.

And if Mrs Theresa May hasn't got an agenda to mess brexit up.

When is she going do something about it, instead of just trying to get her way by running clock down

Its obvious she has no idea what she's doing. In other words out of her depth

How easy it is to quote all the things you hear others say on the news etc. Its Jeremy Corbyn who seems to have no idea, and has called again for a General Election ( that he would lose ), showing that he is not interested in the nest for the country just himself and his lefty lout friends

It doesn’t really matter that Corbyn doesn’t have a clue because just like you and me and everyone else not in government .. he doesn’t need to have a clue.

I think May has always known what she wants and what she believes best for the country but has no bargaining power because her own party are as split as the rest of the country. A leader can only lead those who are willing to be led .. no matter who the leader is. so we can't blame Corbyn for Brexit mess then that's ashamed well we now know who to blame lol

I haven’t seen anyone of any party blame Corbyn for Brexit .. it’s only recently he has popped his head above the parapet lol.

I suppose almost everyone is complicit in the catastrophe due to voting, being ignorant, being obstructive, and a lot of other reasons. However it has never benefited anyone when fingers are pointed .. I’d rather see some constructive ideas of how to get out of the mess. "

I wasn't saying Mr Jeremy Corbyn was to or anyone has blamed Corbyn

I was just saying it's ashame we can't, as we all know that some like to Corbyn bash.

But what is going to happen now my opinion is that this was stage one of staying in eu

Stage two get a vote to take no deal of table which leads us to stage three. A second referendum with hope that country votes remain

As everyone is so fed up with all this brexit mess.

Notonly have brexiteers but also remainers have caused if we all going to be honest and have common sense.

And that's what Mrs Theresa May agenda. Has been from so long. That's what Mrs Theresa May has been working so hard at achieving all along

But that is my opinion and afew others too

Its not everyone opinion of course

But everything does point to my opinion being more likely.

In Asda tonight two old men arguing that this deal that Mrs Theresa May has put together with back stop which effects Ireland just may have rubbed the Ira up the wrong way, they hate Britain has it is

Surely that can't be true can it?

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By (user no longer on site) 14 weeks ago

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"Jacob Rees Mogg made an interesting point tonight, 52% of voters wanted to leave the EU, but the vast majority of MP's want to remain. That is the crux of the matter."

Yes ! They want to remain, as leaving means more work for them, the lazy fuckers !

Its hardly work anyway, is it ?!

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Of course Mrs May has an agenda. That agenda is to take us out of the EU with the least amount of damage and disruption as possible. Her agenda has been thwarted by the hard-line brexiteers in her own party and the sheer bloody-mindedness of the combined opposition parties who are putting their own parties and political ambition before the good of the country. Anyone with any commonsense can see that but commonsense is a commodity in very short supply."

Common Sense? Lol.

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By (user no longer on site) 14 weeks ago

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"Of course Mrs May has an agenda. That agenda is to take us out of the EU with the least amount of damage and disruption as possible. Her agenda has been thwarted by the hard-line brexiteers in her own party and the sheer bloody-mindedness of the combined opposition parties who are putting their own parties and political ambition before the good of the country. Anyone with any commonsense can see that but commonsense is a commodity in very short supply.

Common Sense? Lol. "

Lining your country up for civil unrest is common sense, is it ?

They have lit the touch-paper. But when it goes off, they'll blame every other fucker. Same old, same old !

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*oredEric By *oredEric  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Jacob Rees Mogg made an interesting point tonight, 52% of voters wanted to leave the EU, but the vast majority of MP's want to remain. That is the crux of the matter."

Slight issue with your math. 52% is a majority. 48% split between not arsed or remain. In no reality is that a "vast majority".

Of those who voted, 52% said Exit. 48% remain. Those who didn't vote can't complain. But there is no "vast majority" on either side.

The balance of the argument if those who bothered to engage was to leave the EU.

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Of course Mrs May has an agenda. That agenda is to take us out of the EU with the least amount of damage and disruption as possible. Her agenda has been thwarted by the hard-line brexiteers in her own party and the sheer bloody-mindedness of the combined opposition parties who are putting their own parties and political ambition before the good of the country. Anyone with any commonsense can see that but commonsense is a commodity in very short supply.

Common Sense? Lol.

Lining your country up for civil unrest is common sense, is it ?

They have lit the touch-paper. But when it goes off, they'll blame every other fucker. Same old, same old !"

I have no time for civil unrest .. it’s the course of criminals and wankers and you only have to look to our past of ignorance and the French who still kick off at every opportunity.

So no I do not think civil unrest ever solved anything (except for the looters) but I want to leave the EU. I want to leave the EU with the best possible deal.

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By (user no longer on site) 14 weeks ago

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"Jacob Rees Mogg made an interesting point tonight, 52% of voters wanted to leave the EU, but the vast majority of MP's want to remain. That is the crux of the matter.

Slight issue with your math. 52% is a majority. 48% split between not arsed or remain. In no reality is that a "vast majority".

Of those who voted, 52% said Exit. 48% remain. Those who didn't vote can't complain. But there is no "vast majority" on either side.

The balance of the argument if those who bothered to engage was to leave the EU."

I think he means the MP's who don't give a fuck about the people that voted for them, and voted Leave EU.

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Jacob Rees Mogg made an interesting point tonight, 52% of voters wanted to leave the EU, but the vast majority of MP's want to remain. That is the crux of the matter.

Slight issue with your math. 52% is a majority. 48% split between not arsed or remain. In no reality is that a "vast majority".

Of those who voted, 52% said Exit. 48% remain. Those who didn't vote can't complain. But there is no "vast majority" on either side.

The balance of the argument if those who bothered to engage was to leave the EU."

Of those who voted it was almost an even split hence all the indecision and arguing. Had it even been a reasonable majority things would be very different.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 14 weeks ago

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I know that she was heavily criticised for doing it, and the outcome was far from satisfactory, but Mrs May did give the country the chance to return a 'Brexit Parliament' in June 2017. Instead people voted for just about every other reason imaginable. As a result we have something like 400 Remainers in the HOC.

I do know that some remainers and some Brexiteers have supported the deal that is currently on the table but others are being just plain pig-headed about it yet they must surely realise that there is no consensus for a way forward out of this impasse.

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*9al By *9al  (M) 14 weeks ago

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in that election the lib dems were the only party advocating remain & got very few votes. Conservatives advocating an extreme hard Brexit had their majority removed . it would seem the majority would be ok with a reasonably negotiated soft Brexit . May has pandered to the ERG & the DUP who represent a tiny minority of opinion ,

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By *aravaggio  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Jacob Rees Mogg made an interesting point tonight, 52% of voters wanted to leave the EU, but the vast majority of MP's want to remain. That is the crux of the matter.

Slight issue with your math. 52% is a majority. 48% split between not arsed or remain. In no reality is that a "vast majority".

Of those who voted, 52% said Exit. 48% remain. Those who didn't vote can't complain. But there is no "vast majority" on either side.

The balance of the argument if those who bothered to engage was to leave the EU."

If the vote had been done on a constituency basis as per any normal vote in this country, then the result would have been very, very different, plus of course, MP's, irrespective of their own selfish thoughts, would have had to represent the views of the majority of their constituents. Cameron knew this when he organised the referendum. Just another way in which the whole thing backfired on him, and now the MP's are trying desperately to regain the status quo at the expense of the electorate …… I'm really looking forward to the next MP who comes knocking at my door, I will crucify him …

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"in that election the lib dems were the only party advocating remain & got very few votes. Conservatives advocating an extreme hard Brexit had their majority removed . it would seem the majority would be ok with a reasonably negotiated soft Brexit . May has pandered to the ERG & the DUP who represent a tiny minority of opinion , "

True. There is much talk about democracy but it is a sad day for democracy when the country is actually being run by the right wing of the Tory party and the DUP. A small number of people holding the entire country to ransom, and they know it.

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By *oondog   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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JRM is still hoping that no-deal will happen and is relying on there being very little time to change the law to stop that. He said as much to Andrew Neil last night.

If the vote goes ahead today and no-deal is genuinely taken out of the equation then that changes everything for the ERG and all the hard Brexiteers whichever party.

Faced with a delayed soft Brexit, or possibly no Brexit at all the ERG will have no real choice but to fall in behind the deal. The only question is whether they have enough numbers to carry the vote.

Mrs May runs the vote again and it gets passed or is significantly closer.

If the no-deal vote turns to chaos or doesn't posit a legal way out of it, or indeed is defeated then the ERG have what they want.

The EU could still play hardball and say no extension or a very long extension only to carry them through the election and ratification period.

My preference would have been the deal got approved last night.

This could go on for many years yet and is a masterclass in how not to exit the EU.

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By *oondog   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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"

True. There is much talk about democracy but it is a sad day for democracy when the country is actually being run by the right wing of the Tory party and the DUP. A small number of people holding the entire country to ransom, and they know it."

The opposition are allowing that to happen though and need to shoulder some of the blame. The Tories have always been deeply divided over Europe.

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*hris51234 By  *hris51234    profile verified by photo premium paying member (M) 14 weeks ago

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In my opinion ALL parties are to blame for not carrying out the wishes of the country reguardless of the size of the majority, however it was approached in the wrong way and as far as i can see the Government is at fault for that. All parties should have been present and involved in all negotiations that way all parties would have had their say and would know exactly what was going on at all times and would have had the option to raise concerns as and when they cropped up therefore when it came to the voting stage all would have been passed without it turning into the mockery it has become. In doing so Parliament would have served the nation in the way the majority of the nation requested to be served, which after all is the duty of Parliament, to serve the people not themselves, as a result i feel this could lead to the end of democracy in this country as we know it, the present Government is not fit for purpose as things stand and becuase of the conduct of opposition of late they too are unfit to govern the U.K. in my opinion.

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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"My preference would have been the deal got approved last night."

ditto!

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"

True. There is much talk about democracy but it is a sad day for democracy when the country is actually being run by the right wing of the Tory party and the DUP. A small number of people holding the entire country to ransom, and they know it.

The opposition are allowing that to happen though and need to shoulder some of the blame. The Tories have always been deeply divided over Europe."

I agree that everyone has to shoulder some of the blame but there have been calls for a cross-party approach since the outset and May has ignored them all. She still seems to believe that she is a strong and stable leader despite all the evidence to the contrary

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*9al By *9al  (M) 14 weeks ago

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Mrs May should resign she has lost 2 votes it was obvious even before Christmas this deal would not go though , she has waisted 3 months & possibly 2 years on her own ego trip

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By *aver20   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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One of the points that is not well covered is that this deal is not a trade deal it's the agreement on the 'divorce ' settlement and principles for the future trade arrangements. We have another couple of years of negotiation to go. At the end of which we may still not get a deal, and back stop comes into effect. Effectively we will have agreed to pay up front without a trade deal.

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By *oondog   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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I'm not a big Andrew Neil fan but watching him with Jacob R-M last night where he told him he'd squandered the chance for Brexit and had got it wrong to let the chance last night slip through his fingers was good viewing.

If it turns out to be true then it serves the toff right lol

I voted remain but I've come round to be at peace with Brexit but I wish they'd just get on with it!

Actually now I could accept either outcome remain or leave but I don't want it to take years of torture.

If this does kill off Brexit then JRM will go down in history as as big a fool as Cameron.

Hang on in there Mrs May! It wouldn't surprise me if the deal springs back to life like Lazarus lol

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*9al By *9al  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"One of the points that is not well covered is that this deal is not a trade deal it's the agreement on the 'divorce ' settlement and principles for the future trade arrangements. We have another couple of years of negotiation to go. At the end of which we may still not get a deal, and back stop comes into effect. Effectively we will have agreed to pay up front without a trade deal."

that is the problem this deal commits us to paying the EU money & has unacceptable strings, all we gain is time to negotiate , we cant let May waste that time as she has wasted the previous 2 years

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 14 weeks ago

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Have just heard an interesting interview with a political commentator who thinks that May might think that 149 is not a major defeat and will bring her deal back for a third vote on the basis that she is getting closer to getting it through. We are experiencing the Chinese curse of living in interesting times, so I think that is quite possible.

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By *oondog   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Have just heard an interesting interview with a political commentator who thinks that May might think that 149 is not a major defeat and will bring her deal back for a third vote on the basis that she is getting closer to getting it through. We are experiencing the Chinese curse of living in interesting times, so I think that is quite possible."

I think you are absolutely right. Until someone replaces it with something then it's the only deal in town.

I made the point earlier that if no-deal genuinely comes off the table all those hoping for it have nowhere to go for a hard Brexit except the deal.

I don't think anyone should be surprised (given recent history) that Mrs May will carry on and will promote the deal at every opportunity completely unashamedly.

She will go on until they force her out that is no surprise at all.

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*hris51234 By  *hris51234    profile verified by photo premium paying member (M) 14 weeks ago

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The problem is May is ruled by her own ego and has the desire to be remembered as the Primeminister who led the U.K out of the EU and is blind to the fact all she is doing is failing miserably and is more likely to be remembered as the worse leader in history!

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By *aravaggio  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"in that election the lib dems were the only party advocating remain & got very few votes. Conservatives advocating an extreme hard Brexit had their majority removed . it would seem the majority would be ok with a reasonably negotiated soft Brexit . May has pandered to the ERG & the DUP who represent a tiny minority of opinion ,

True. There is much talk about democracy but it is a sad day for democracy when the country is actually being run by the right wing of the Tory party and the DUP. A small number of people holding the entire country to ransom, and they know it."

52% versus 48% for leave, yet you say its the leavers holding the country to ransom????? Yeah, right! ..

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By *aravaggio  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"When is Mrs Theresa May see that big parts of her deal is just not good enough.

And if Mrs Theresa May hasn't got an agenda to mess brexit up.

When is she going do something about it, instead of just trying to get her way by running clock down

Its obvious she has no idea what she's doing. In other words out of her depth

How easy it is to quote all the things you hear others say on the news etc. Its Jeremy Corbyn who seems to have no idea, and has called again for a General Election ( that he would lose ), showing that he is not interested in the nest for the country just himself and his lefty lout friends

It doesn’t really matter that Corbyn doesn’t have a clue because just like you and me and everyone else not in government .. he doesn’t need to have a clue.

I think May has always known what she wants and what she believes best for the country but has no bargaining power because her own party are as split as the rest of the country. A leader can only lead those who are willing to be led .. no matter who the leader is. so we can't blame Corbyn for Brexit mess then that's ashamed well we now know who to blame lol"

Well, actually, Danny, we can blame Corbyn for participating in the Brexit mess. At the last GE, he stood on a mandate to leave the EU. The Labour Party have about turned on that mandate, now turning all their attentions to another General Election and putting fwd a version of Brexit that is so laughably NOT Brexit as originally voted for.

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By *aravaggio  (M) 14 weeks ago

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ENOUGH!!!! …. the past 2.5 years has been a period of fudge and deliberate obfuscation by a large group of Parliamentarians and others of establishment thinking, who wish to overturn the mandate of the people. The really sad thing about it all, is that if we were of the French mentality, they wouldn't dare!!!!!

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*oredEric By *oredEric  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"ENOUGH!!!! …. the past 2.5 years has been a period of fudge and deliberate obfuscation by a large group of Parliamentarians and others of establishment thinking, who wish to overturn the mandate of the people. The really sad thing about it all, is that if we were of the French mentality, they wouldn't dare!!!!! "

Abso-fucking-lutely! The actual result is irrelevant, the Will of the People, Parliament by and for the people, they are our representatives not our Lords and Masters.

Except the truth is out. We're irrelevant, we do as we're told, we get what we're given.

Remain or Leave, I still argue the vote was more about people eating to be listened to, and their opinion to count. That once the Exit vote was in they'd realise and after some restructuring and listening they'd change and then we could revisit the question and Remain.

But no, even when the issues are bayed in their faces they answer a different question of their own making, or accuse the questioner of an ism, or say they don't understand the issues. What utter fucking arrogance and hubris!

These people aren't some God chosen intellectual elite who have a better understanding, they're intellectual pygmies who fiddle their expenses, line their own pockets, and can be bought off by lobbyists. They're no more fit run anything than 650 people picked randomly off here.

We need a change. At the next election I'm minded to stand as a Remember the Referendum candidate, 67% Leave here, but they Vote Labour, "I vote Labour because I've always voted Labour", no matter the current party makes Mrs Thatcher look like a fucking Communist. Stand on the basis of remember what you voted for, look what you got. Her record of saying one thing in the Constituency but voting differently in Parliament, and where's the Socialist Paradise we should enjoy here after decades of Labour rule. Crap Towns top 10, again. Across the country we've been betrayed by this lot time for a change. If we rebelled like they do in France these people would have no qualms in massacring the protestors then claim they were infiltrated by terror groups.

The system as is has broken irretrievably.

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Of course Mrs May has an agenda. That agenda is to take us out of the EU with the least amount of damage and disruption as possible. Her agenda has been thwarted by the hard-line brexiteers in her own party and the sheer bloody-mindedness of the combined opposition parties who are putting their own parties and political ambition before the good of the country. Anyone with any commonsense can see that but commonsense is a commodity in very short supply.

Common Sense? Lol.

Lining your country up for civil unrest is common sense, is it ?

They have lit the touch-paper. But when it goes off, they'll blame every other fucker. Same old, same old !"

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By *cousedpw   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Jacob Rees Mogg made an interesting point tonight, 52% of voters wanted to leave the EU, but the vast majority of MP's want to remain. That is the crux of the matter.

Slight issue with your math. 52% is a majority. 48% split between not arsed or remain. In no reality is that a "vast majority".

Of those who voted, 52% said Exit. 48% remain. Those who didn't vote can't complain. But there is no "vast majority" on either side.

The balance of the argument if those who bothered to engage was to leave the EU."

You should have gone to Specsaves.

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By *ockpleaser  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Jacob Rees Mogg made an interesting point tonight, 52% of voters wanted to leave the EU, but the vast majority of MP's want to remain. That is the crux of the matter.

Slight issue with your math. 52% is a majority. 48% split between not arsed or remain. In no reality is that a "vast majority".

Of those who voted, 52% said Exit. 48% remain. Those who didn't vote can't complain. But there is no "vast majority" on either side.

The balance of the argument if those who bothered to engage was to leave the EU.

You should have gone to Specsaves. "

He clearly didn't read your post properly. You highlight an interesting point regarding the disconnect between what the electorate wanted at the time of the referendum and what MP's want now.

I think the problem is there is no accountability. When the next general election comes these self-serving MPs won't be taken to task over their failure to follow-through.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Jacob Rees Mogg made an interesting point tonight, 52% of voters wanted to leave the EU, but the vast majority of MP's want to remain. That is the crux of the matter.

Slight issue with your math. 52% is a majority. 48% split between not arsed or remain. In no reality is that a "vast majority".

Of those who voted, 52% said Exit. 48% remain. Those who didn't vote can't complain. But there is no "vast majority" on either side.

The balance of the argument if those who bothered to engage was to leave the EU.

You should have gone to Specsaves. "

I bet Jacob Rees-Mogg doesn't go to Specsavers

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By *ockpleaser  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Jacob Rees Mogg made an interesting point tonight, 52% of voters wanted to leave the EU, but the vast majority of MP's want to remain. That is the crux of the matter.

Slight issue with your math. 52% is a majority. 48% split between not arsed or remain. In no reality is that a "vast majority".

Of those who voted, 52% said Exit. 48% remain. Those who didn't vote can't complain. But there is no "vast majority" on either side.

The balance of the argument if those who bothered to engage was to leave the EU.

You should have gone to Specsaves.

I bet Jacob Rees-Mogg doesn't go to Specsavers "

He probably owns spec savers lol

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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Ideal for your diamond encrusted monocle or gold plated pince-nez.

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By *ormicb  (M) 14 weeks ago

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I really hope it doesn't happen, but I've learnt not to get my hopes up. People voted against their best interests and there's too many in parliament and the media who won't make that mistake.

After all this time I've yet to hear a real benefit to leaving the EU, certainly not for a no deal brexit. As someone of working age who isn't a multi millionaire I'd like to keep my protections rather than have special interest politicians sell them down the river

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By *poty   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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Looks like we are going to stay in . Good bye Mrs May.

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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Mrs thersea may as become an serial LOSER according to some but this just stage two of messing brexit up

Next up second referendum

Just hope that second referendum is onlyto dsort out leave with deal or no Deal

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By *hemaligfreund   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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No way, a third referendum must include the option to remain to overcome the lies told by the enemy, and to put them firmly in their place so they can never attempt to remove our rights, freedoms and protections and make us poorer ever again.

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Looks like we are going to stay in . Good bye Mrs May. "

with any luck it is good bye Mrs may.

She is rather out of her depth and as been for a long time

Or its all been her agenda to keep us in eu

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 14 weeks ago

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it will be interesting to hear what Daisy has to say after this evening's vote. I increasingly believe she will bring back her deal for a third vote. What disturbs me most are the reports of Farage talking to other populists to get them to veto an extension to Article 50. Not exactly healthy company to be keeping.

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"No way, a third referendum must include the option to remain to overcome the lies told by the enemy, and to put them firmly in their place so they can never attempt to remove our rights, freedoms and protections and make us poorer ever again."

who the fuck is the enemy

And if you are on about leavers please explain why staying in eu and leaving so bad.

Looks like you have been suckered in to believeing every scaremongering stories put out by remainers

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"it will be interesting to hear what Daisy has to say after this evening's vote. I increasingly believe she will bring back her deal for a third vote. What disturbs me most are the reports of Farage talking to other populists to get them to veto an extension to Article 50. Not exactly healthy company to be keeping."

you won't hear anything from Mrs thersea (daisy) may as she as conveniently lost her voice yet again

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"No way, a third referendum must include the option to remain to overcome the lies told by the enemy, and to put them firmly in their place so they can never attempt to remove our rights, freedoms and protections and make us poorer ever again.who the fuck is the enemy

And if you are on about leavers please explain why staying in eu and leaving so bad.

Looks like you have been suckered in to believeing every scaremongering stories put out by remainers "

and leavers are to be believed and trusted? Ha, ha. Ha!

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"No way, a third referendum must include the option to remain to overcome the lies told by the enemy, and to put them firmly in their place so they can never attempt to remove our rights, freedoms and protections and make us poorer ever again.who the fuck is the enemy

And if you are on about leavers please explain why staying in eu and leaving so bad.

Looks like you have been suckered in to believeing every scaremongering stories put out by remainers

and leavers are to be believed and trusted? Ha, ha. Ha!"

yes you are right the bullshit is coming from both sides but you know it more remainers though

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By *poty   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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Boris is ready to be PM . He's had his hair cut.

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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Please no rather have out if her depth Mrs may

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 14 weeks ago

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Now it's clear that she is going to bring her deal back for a third time. That does rather explain her lack of action over the last three months - just taking it to the wire and hoping she scares enough Tory MPs to do a U-turn and accept the deal they said was totally unacceptable. Deplorable behaviour ... or a very astute politician?

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"No way, a third referendum must include the option to remain to overcome the lies told by the enemy, and to put them firmly in their place so they can never attempt to remove our rights, freedoms and protections and make us poorer ever again.who the fuck is the enemy

And if you are on about leavers please explain why staying in eu and leaving so bad.

Looks like you have been suckered in to believeing every scaremongering stories put out by remainers

and leavers are to be believed and trusted? Ha, ha. Ha!yes you are right the bullshit is coming from both sides but you know it more remainers though "

I personally think more crap is being spouted by the racist leavers than anyone else

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*hris51234 By  *hris51234    profile verified by photo premium paying member (M) 14 weeks ago

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What i make from watching Parliament live, the motion for No Deal IS NOT legally binding so therefore the way things stand at the moment we are still set to leave the EU on the 29th of this month and if a deal hasn't been agreed then we will leave with no deal, and it is very unlikely the speaker will allow Mrs. May to pesent the existing deal for a third time.

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By (user no longer on site) 14 weeks ago

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"No way, a third referendum must include the option to remain to overcome the lies told by the enemy, and to put them firmly in their place so they can never attempt to remove our rights, freedoms and protections and make us poorer ever again.who the fuck is the enemy

And if you are on about leavers please explain why staying in eu and leaving so bad.

Looks like you have been suckered in to believeing every scaremongering stories put out by remainers

and leavers are to be believed and trusted? Ha, ha. Ha!yes you are right the bullshit is coming from both sides but you know it more remainers though

I personally think more crap is being spouted by the racist leavers than anyone else"

How dare you call people racists, when you've never even met them !!

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*etropolis By *etropolis   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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An awful lot of MP's are going to lose their seats at the next election. They will learn that you don't do against those who voted for you.

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By (user no longer on site) 14 weeks ago

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Your right there !

And i have spent half the day chatting with friends of mine, that didn't think it was worth voting 'leave'in the last referendum. Well they bloody well know, now !

Until yesterday, i thought a 2nd referendum would be unfair. Now, i can't fuckin wait!!!

Treacherous CUNTS !!!

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*oredEric By *oredEric  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"An awful lot of MP's are going to lose their seats at the next election. They will learn that you don't do against those who voted for you."

But they won't. Hull voted 67% to Leave. The three Hull MPs, all Labour, did their best to do absolutely nothing. They will tell you to your face that once elected and given the mandate they follow their own conscience, and coincidentally party policy slavishly. They've ignored the will of the people. But they'll all be re-elected, because of "I vote Labour because I've always voted Labour". The electorate here in the main applied no conscious thought to the process. Labour could out up Hitler, Stalin, and Mrs Thatcher in Hull, they'd all get in with 20k majorities as long as they wear the red rosette. They'd vote in a turd in a red rosette, how else do you explain Lard John Prescott?

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"No way, a third referendum must include the option to remain to overcome the lies told by the enemy, and to put them firmly in their place so they can never attempt to remove our rights, freedoms and protections and make us poorer ever again.who the fuck is the enemy

And if you are on about leavers please explain why staying in eu and leaving so bad.

Looks like you have been suckered in to believeing every scaremongering stories put out by remainers

and leavers are to be believed and trusted? Ha, ha. Ha!yes you are right the bullshit is coming from both sides but you know it more remainers though

I personally think more crap is being spouted by the racist leavers than anyone else

How dare you call people racists, when you've never even met them !! "

Bit sensitive chuckie? I can call murderers even if I’ve not met them. Get over yourself

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"No way, a third referendum must include the option to remain to overcome the lies told by the enemy, and to put them firmly in their place so they can never attempt to remove our rights, freedoms and protections and make us poorer ever again.who the fuck is the enemy

And if you are on about leavers please explain why staying in eu and leaving so bad.

Looks like you have been suckered in to believeing every scaremongering stories put out by remainers

and leavers are to be believed and trusted? Ha, ha. Ha!yes you are right the bullshit is coming from both sides but you know it more remainers though

I personally think more crap is being spouted by the racist leavers than anyone else

How dare you call people racists, when you've never even met them !! "

very well put there couldn't agree more

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"No way, a third referendum must include the option to remain to overcome the lies told by the enemy, and to put them firmly in their place so they can never attempt to remove our rights, freedoms and protections and make us poorer ever again.who the fuck is the enemy

And if you are on about leavers please explain why staying in eu and leaving so bad.

Looks like you have been suckered in to believeing every scaremongering stories put out by remainers

and leavers are to be believed and trusted? Ha, ha. Ha!yes you are right the bullshit is coming from both sides but you know it more remainers though

I personally think more crap is being spouted by the racist leavers than anyone else

How dare you call people racists, when you've never even met them !! very well put there couldn't agree more "

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 14 weeks ago

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I’m looking forward to all the leavers screaming when there’s a Peoples Vote and they are well and truly put back in their box

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By *oetvsub  (TV/TS/CD) 14 weeks ago

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May's 'deal' was NOT a deal...it was a way of keeping us bound to the EU indefinitely whilst we attempt to strike a trade deal, stopping us in the meantime from negotiating elsewhere and keeping us bound to the EU courts whilst continuing to pay them during that time + the £39B! All her words were actually opposite to what the 580+ document contained! We can't make our mind up whether she is incredibly THICK or whether she is incredibly clever going by the dictates of the bureaucratic civil service in cahoots with the equivalent EU bureaucrats.

The irony of all of these votes tonight is that the REMAIN Parliament is voting for a no-deal Brexit and will inevitably vote to extend Article 50 and ultimately unless they have any positive proposal as to why they should extend the EU will deny them the chance which ultimately goes back to the very reason why we voted to leave the EU for the fact the EU overrides our Parliament!!! Whenever the REMOANERS finally realise that will be too late.

Personally i am hoping to God we leave on the 29th with No Deal. Failing that there will either be REVOLUTION or the death knell of democracy in this country dating back to 1215 the Magna Carta. Alternatively May finally calls a General Election and then both Cons and Lab parties can be kicked out like the Liberal UNdemocrats or the Remain Undemocratic Independent Group...and make way for a Brexit Party...and we can then remove the Civil Service whilst we're at it.

As for another Referendum...that plays to big business and the establishment. They even talk of taking true full Brexit off the choice! How democratic is that! And if we vote remain...do we have best of 3 etc etc?!

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By *oxyman  (TV/TS/CD) 14 weeks ago

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If we stay in we will get screwed apparently there is going to be no veto so what ever they decide we have to abide by. Also in three years all countries will have to be in the euro so no pound

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By *orum reader  (M) 14 weeks ago

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How many times has the PM said that is undemocratic to have a so called people's vote as the vote was held in 2016

If that is the case why is ok for her deal to be put Parliament twice and possibly a 3rd time ??

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By *cousedpw   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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Love the friendly banter on here.

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*s55 By *s55  (M) 14 weeks ago

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So True I hope they lose there seats at the next election along with Putin's Puppet Corbyn. Hulls council have also been red forever apart from a liberal disaster they both couldn't organise a shag in a brothel.The City of culture has been and gone they spent most of it with paths and roads being taken up and relaid in the centre. They missed the real culture

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"May's 'deal' was NOT a deal...it was a way of keeping us bound to the EU indefinitely whilst we attempt to strike a trade deal, stopping us in the meantime from negotiating elsewhere and keeping us bound to the EU courts whilst continuing to pay them during that time + the £39B! All her words were actually opposite to what the 580+ document contained! We can't make our mind up whether she is incredibly THICK or whether she is incredibly clever going by the dictates of the bureaucratic civil service in cahoots with the equivalent EU bureaucrats.

The irony of all of these votes tonight is that the REMAIN Parliament is voting for a no-deal Brexit and will inevitably vote to extend Article 50 and ultimately unless they have any positive proposal as to why they should extend the EU will deny them the chance which ultimately goes back to the very reason why we voted to leave the EU for the fact the EU overrides our Parliament!!! Whenever the REMOANERS finally realise that will be too late.

Personally i am hoping to God we leave on the 29th with No Deal. Failing that there will either be REVOLUTION or the death knell of democracy in this country dating back to 1215 the Magna Carta. Alternatively May finally calls a General Election and then both Cons and Lab parties can be kicked out like the Liberal UNdemocrats or the Remain Undemocratic Independent Group...and make way for a Brexit Party...and we can then remove the Civil Service whilst we're at it.

As for another Referendum...that plays to big business and the establishment. They even talk of taking true full Brexit off the choice! How democratic is that! And if we vote remain...do we have best of 3 etc etc?!"

very well said

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"I’m looking forward to all the leavers screaming when there’s a Peoples Vote and they are well and truly put back in their box"

leavers are just ashuman as mardi arsed remainers

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By *ackSutton   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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"leavers are just ashuman as mardi arsed remainers "

Leavers are just as "mardi arsed" as remainers TBF.

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By *ackSutton   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Also in three years all countries will have to be in the euro so no pound"

This is incorrect. If the UK were to stay in the EU then the Euro could not be implemented without agreement of the UK government.

This sort of misinformation makes me sad, as it is accepted as fact with no research at all.

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By *ackSutton   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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To those of you on both sides of the argument, who choose to use terms such as "traitor" or "enemy" please do not forget that a serving MP was brutally murdered by someone who viewed her as such.

These terms add nothing positive to the debate, but only stir up hatred and potential violence.

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By *orum reader  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"To those of you on both sides of the argument, who choose to use terms such as "traitor" or "enemy" please do not forget that a serving MP was brutally murdered by someone who viewed her as such.

These terms add nothing positive to the debate, but only stir up hatred and potential violence."

Very well said

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"To those of you on both sides of the argument, who choose to use terms such as "traitor" or "enemy" please do not forget that a serving MP was brutally murdered by someone who viewed her as such.

These terms add nothing positive to the debate, but only stir up hatred and potential violence."

very well put

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"To those of you on both sides of the argument, who choose to use terms such as "traitor" or "enemy" please do not forget that a serving MP was brutally murdered by someone who viewed her as such.

These terms add nothing positive to the debate, but only stir up hatred and potential violence."

I agree

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By *aravaggio  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"To those of you on both sides of the argument, who choose to use terms such as "traitor" or "enemy" please do not forget that a serving MP was brutally murdered by someone who viewed her as such.

These terms add nothing positive to the debate, but only stir up hatred and potential violence."

Are you inferring that anyone who uses such terminology is unwittingly stirring emotions to horrendous heights?? If so, we may as well delete half the English Oxford dictionary! Words do not kill people. Its twisted minds that do that.

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By *aravaggio  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"What i make from watching Parliament live, the motion for No Deal IS NOT legally binding so therefore the way things stand at the moment we are still set to leave the EU on the 29th of this month and if a deal hasn't been agreed then we will leave with no deal, and it is very unlikely the speaker will allow Mrs. May to pesent the existing deal for a third time."

Correct … this latest "vote" was to test the feelings of Parliament on the matter of leaving without a deal. As it was, it was pretty inconclusive 308/321. HOWEVER, it does show that 321 MPs are either thick as bricks, or did not give their vote with negotiation in mind, as who, in their right mind, would EVER take out the walking away option in a negotiation scenario??

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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It's no surprise the whole brexit thing is in disarray as every vote from the initial referendum to now has shown the country and the politicians practically split down the middle.

Of course that is what happens in a demcracy

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"What i make from watching Parliament live, the motion for No Deal IS NOT legally binding so therefore the way things stand at the moment we are still set to leave the EU on the 29th of this month and if a deal hasn't been agreed then we will leave with no deal, and it is very unlikely the speaker will allow Mrs. May to pesent the existing deal for a third time.

Correct … this latest "vote" was to test the feelings of Parliament on the matter of leaving without a deal. As it was, it was pretty inconclusive 308/321. HOWEVER, it does show that 321 MPs are either thick as bricks, or did not give their vote with negotiation in mind, as who, in their right mind, would EVER take out the walking away option in a negotiation scenario?? "

That was true almost three years ago when negotiations began but my understanding is that negotiations on the withdrawal agreement are over and done with.

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By *aravaggio  (M) 14 weeks ago

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Its complete according to some, namely Mrs May and the EU. However, if we take No Deal off the table, even at this late stage, it really will be complete. As an aside, but very important nevertheless, no negotiation is complete until it is accepted by both sides in full. This agreement as it stands, is clearly not acceptable to the parliament of the UK, therefore it is not complete.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 14 weeks ago

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Farage has just stated on the local radio that he believes he is in a position to persuade at least one Member State to veto an extension of Article 50 so that we can leave on 29 March with no deal. Rather underhanded to say the least.

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*hris51234 By  *hris51234    profile verified by photo premium paying member (M) 14 weeks ago

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If that makes him underhanded i'd say that makes him no different to any other serving MP at present!

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By *aravaggio  (M) 14 weeks ago

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If he is in a position to do that, and didn't, then he'd be going against everything he's stood for all these years. I for one, hope he achieves it.

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By *utitinmybum   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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I personally think all the treacherous mps who are not carrying out the peoples wishes should resign and hopefully we will have a new party who will carry out what the majority voted for.

So let us just leave and can then carry on to become what as a nation we once were.

Put the Great back into Britain.Fuck Europe if they don't want to trade with us.

Their loss.

y

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"I personally think all the treacherous mps who are not carrying out the peoples wishes should resign and hopefully we will have a new party who will carry out what the majority voted for.

So let us just leave and can then carry on to become what as a nation we once were.

Put the Great back into Britain.Fuck Europe if they don't want to trade with us.

Their loss.

y"

totally agree

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"I personally think all the treacherous mps who are not carrying out the peoples wishes should resign and hopefully we will have a new party who will carry out what the majority voted for.

So let us just leave and can then carry on to become what as a nation we once were.

Put the Great back into Britain.Fuck Europe if they don't want to trade with us.

Their loss.

y"

All very well to spout populist, nationalistic bile but what you say does not reflect economic reality.

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By *aravaggio  (M) 14 weeks ago

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Nationalistic bile????? Are you sure you meant to say that?

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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All this time and it’s still a rarity to see an intelligent contribution to any Brexit thread.

I would agree with right honourable gentleman who mentioned bile!

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*Ybear By *Ybear  (M) 14 weeks ago

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There are 3 options deal, no deal or remain. The first 2 have been ruled out by the HoC that means they support remain.

The legal situation is that we leave on 29/03 with or without a deal. To change this will require a change in the law.

If we leave on WTO rules we can continue to trade on the existing arrangements for up to 3 years unless a new trading agreement is made before then.

In that 3 year period we can also negotiate trade deals with other countries.

Some say what are the benefits of leaving, the most obvious one is that when the EU makes trade agreements it has to take into account the French wine industry Greek olive oil and Spanish oranges, we don’t so can agree to accept these from other countries in exchange for concessions on our products.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 14 weeks ago

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GYBear:- Not sure if that is totally true but thank you at least for a sensible and readable post amidst all the keyboard sniping and negativity on this thread.

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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What's to positive about with this mess. And what is so positive of what Mrs thersea may is doing

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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"There are 3 options deal, no deal or remain. The first 2 have been ruled out by the HoC that means they support remain.

The legal situation is that we leave on 29/03 with or without a deal. To change this will require a change in the law.

If we leave on WTO rules we can continue to trade on the existing arrangements for up to 3 years unless a new trading agreement is made before then.

In that 3 year period we can also negotiate trade deals with other countries.

Some say what are the benefits of leaving, the most obvious one is that when the EU makes trade agreements it has to take into account the French wine industry Greek olive oil and Spanish oranges, we don’t so can agree to accept these from other countries in exchange for concessions on our products."

A good well thought out post! Even when not necessarily in agreement it is good to read a post with a bit of content.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 14 weeks ago

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Two things I am wondering about. If holding a People's Vote is anti-democratic because the answer has already been given, why is it democratic for May to bring back her deal for a third time when she has already had her answer not once but twice?

Secondly, I note that the DUP are 'considering' whether they can now back the deal they have rejected wholeheartedly twice already. How much is the sweetener/bung they have been offered this time?

All a very strange type of democratic process.

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 14 weeks ago

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"Two things I am wondering about. If holding a People's Vote is anti-democratic because the answer has already been given, why is it democratic for May to bring back her deal for a third time when she has already had her answer not once but twice?

Secondly, I note that the DUP are 'considering' whether they can now back the deal they have rejected wholeheartedly twice already. How much is the sweetener/bung they have been offered this time?

All a very strange type of democratic process."

I'm sure this is just the usual everyday behaviour in politics of all parties and all countries - it's taken Brexit to make it more transparent.

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*hris51234 By  *hris51234    profile verified by photo premium paying member (M) 14 weeks ago

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An ammendment to request an extention to Article 50 in order to hold a second referendum has been defeated 334-85

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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MPs have voted by 412 to 202 for Prime Minister Theresa May to ask the EU for a delay to Brexit.

The above quote is from bbc news and is same everywhere else

So where did you get your figures Mr Chris

If I have wrong end of stick I apologise now

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By *orum reader  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"MPs have voted by 412 to 202 for Prime Minister Theresa May to ask the EU for a delay to Brexit.

The above quote is from bbc news and is same everywhere else

So where did you get your figures Mr Chris

If I have wrong end of stick I apologise now "

They were different votes

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By *annyboy87  (M) 14 weeks ago

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Thanks Mr _orum reader for putting me right over mix up

I apologise Mr Chris I was wrong

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*hris51234 By  *hris51234    profile verified by photo premium paying member (M) 14 weeks ago

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No need for appology but thankyou anyway, there where a number of amendments voted on earlier and i only posted on the one so can see the confusion over it

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By *ormicb  (M) 14 weeks ago

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"No need for appology but thankyou anyway, there where a number of amendments voted on earlier and i only posted on the one so can see the confusion over it"

I understand why there's multiple votes, but parliament couldn't have obfuscated things more if they'd tried!

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By *hemaligfreund   profile verified by photo (M) 8 weeks ago

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"To those of you on both sides of the argument, who choose to use terms such as "traitor" or "enemy" please do not forget that a serving MP was brutally murdered by someone who viewed her as such.

These terms add nothing positive to the debate, but only stir up hatred and potential violence."

And let's not forget which side killed her, which side has threatened violence if they don't get their way, which side is supported by Yaxley-Lennon and the far right.....you got it, the separatists!

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By *aravaggio  (M) 8 weeks ago

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If you are of the opinion that extremists DON'T exist on both sides of the divide, then your political awareness cannot be taken seriously. Are you fully aware of the state of mind of the right wing killer? Of course you aren't, but nevertheless, you are happy to tarnish all those who hold different views to your own with social depravity. That action/viewpoint is in itself, contemptible.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 8 weeks ago

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"To those of you on both sides of the argument, who choose to use terms such as "traitor" or "enemy" please do not forget that a serving MP was brutally murdered by someone who viewed her as such.

These terms add nothing positive to the debate, but only stir up hatred and potential violence.

And let's not forget which side killed her, which side has threatened violence if they don't get their way, which side is supported by Yaxley-Lennon and the far right.....you got it, the separatists! "

A bit like moderate Labour MPs being threatened by Momentum supporters. Extremism works both ways.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 8 weeks ago

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Extremism does indeed work both ways but could those who are deflecting please cite the murder of a political opponent by Momentum as I must have missed it. And before you jump to false conclusions, I am NOT a Momentum supporter but I have not seem them use the same level of threats as the far right equivalent.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 8 weeks ago

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Extremism does indeed work both ways but could those who are deflecting please cite the murder of a political opponent by Momentum as I must have missed it. And before you jump to false conclusions, I am NOT a Momentum supporter but I have not seem them use the same level of threats as the far right equivalent.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 8 weeks ago

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" I am NOT a Momentum supporter "

Really??? You always claim you are not and also claim to ne 'independent' yet you always jump to the defence of them and the hard left.

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By *aravaggio  (M) 8 weeks ago

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Give the guy his due, he actually admitted that he voted LibDem on at least one occasion, not many would have the courage to do that!! …

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 8 weeks ago

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More deflection but you haven't cited the example I requested.

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By *aravaggio  (M) 8 weeks ago

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Momentum plus this government, is doing its damnedest to murder British politics. However, I imagine all murderers have their political leanings. How many shout it out at the moment of their foul deed? Probably only those who see their party as terrorists or fighting in the literary sense for a cause, and of course, the mentally insane. Apart from the Irish factions, I can't recall any other political organisations within UK who openly resort to violence as a means of getting their message across ………. so, the accusation that UKIP and their like are murderous parties is totally without foundation.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 8 weeks ago

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Except that one of their number did commit a murder.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 8 weeks ago

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Has a member of UKIP ever committed murder? I know their one time leader, Nigel Farage, often 'murdered' a pint of real ale to quench his thirst after a speech.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 8 weeks ago

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One of 'their like' has. Judging by the rubbish that comes out of his mouth, I think Farage has downed numerous pints before he speaks.

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 8 weeks ago

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I believe the whole Brexit debacle has shown what can happen to a country which has lived for many years in a bubble with no major enemies, no natural disasters and no real concerns.

You become complacent and start searching for things to be unhappy about, invent problems which aren't there.

We have gone from being a successful country progressing nicely with unemployment going down, wages rising and businesses being generally positive .. the NHS which looks after everyone, education for all, benefits for those in need. a country where (obviously not perfect) has looked after it's old, vulnerable, young and unemployed.

Well what have we gone to??? I certainly don't know and I hope we will eventually have gopne to something better but we will see. At the moment all I see is a worse political scene. Some worrying scenarios and a nation of practically 100% unhappy people !!!

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*kws By *kws  (M) 8 weeks ago

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What people don't realise is that the EU countries need us more than we need them because WHEN we get out we can then import things, maybe cheaper, that they send to us. Regarding Farage he does say things that a lot of people are thinking and are, in this day and age, to afraid to say.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 8 weeks ago

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"One of 'their like' has. Judging by the rubbish that comes out of his mouth, I think Farage has downed numerous pints before he speaks."

I'm no fan of UKIP and I tend to dismiss Farage as a bit of a buffoon, but they don't go around murdering people and, as far as I know, they do not have any murderers in their party. Momentum have threatened several Labour MPs and the leaders of at least two councils with physical and sexual violence so much so that some even leftish leaning members of the Labour Party have called on Jeremy Corbyn to disbandon Momentum.

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*Ybear By *Ybear  (M) 8 weeks ago

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"Except that one of their number did commit a murder."

Wrong, a man with a long history of mental health issues acted out and in his deranged state hit out at what he saw as an instrument of his oppression in self defence.

This incident does not have anything to do with Brexit rather it highlights the deficiencies of our mental health services.

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*Ybear By *Ybear  (M) 8 weeks ago

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"Extremism does indeed work both ways but could those who are deflecting please cite the murder of a political opponent by Momentum as I must have missed it. And before you jump to false conclusions, I am NOT a Momentum supporter but I have not seem them use the same level of threats as the far right equivalent."

I would suggest you look at a group called “antifa” which claims it is an anti fascist organisation and goes around disrupting gatherings it disapproves of using violence and threats as well as targeting individuals.

When you have done your research try telling me they are not the latest incarnation of the brownshirts.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 8 weeks ago

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"Except that one of their number did commit a murder.

Wrong, a man with a long history of mental health issues acted out and in his deranged state hit out at what he saw as an instrument of his oppression in self defence.

This incident does not have anything to do with Brexit rather it highlights the deficiencies of our mental health services."

Very true. The despicable murder of MP Jo Cox took place about a week or so before the EU referendum and her assassin was not affiliated to any legitimate political party

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*Ybear By *Ybear  (M) 8 weeks ago

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There was a previous case when a LibDem MP was attacked by a man with a sword at his surgery, sadly his agent died. This was long before Brexit was even thought about.

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