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The Boris Plan. A new diet.

By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 1 week ago

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The Atkins Diet plan has nothing on Boris.

Boris plan, You’ll lose far more than a few pounds.

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 1 week ago

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"The Atkins Diet plan has nothing on Boris.

Boris plan, You’ll lose far more than a few pounds. "

the Boris Ditch Diet

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By *ikkey69  (M) 1 week ago

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"The Atkins Diet plan has nothing on Boris.

Boris plan, You’ll lose far more than a few pounds. "

Whats a few pounds when we get our country back, our fisheries back and 2.7 billion people to trade and prosper with.

Soon be 31st October !!!

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 1 week ago

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Chlorinated chicken with ditchwater gravy - mmmm

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 1 week ago

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"The Atkins Diet plan has nothing on Boris.

Boris plan, You’ll lose far more than a few pounds.

Whats a few pounds when we get our country back, our fisheries back and 2.7 billion people to trade and prosper with.

Soon be 31st October !!!"

You’ll be £1000 richer Mikkey.. don’t forget my pledge on the other thread. Spend it any way like.

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 1 week ago

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Do they do a ‘day passport’ if you’re going to that place in Switzerland?

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 1 week ago

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"The Atkins Diet plan has nothing on Boris.

Boris plan, You’ll lose far more than a few pounds.

Whats a few pounds when we get our country back, our fisheries back and 2.7 billion people to trade and prosper with.

Soon be 31st October !!!"

So, mikkey, what are you going to do if your saviour Boris has a change of heart and asks for an extension for a few months? I’m presuming that you won’t get defensive about it?

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 1 week ago

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"The Atkins Diet plan has nothing on Boris.

Boris plan, You’ll lose far more than a few pounds.

Whats a few pounds when we get our country back, our fisheries back and 2.7 billion people to trade and prosper with.

Soon be 31st October !!!

So, mikkey, what are you going to do if your saviour Boris has a change of heart and asks for an extension for a few months? I’m presuming that you won’t get defensive about it?"

To be fair, he doesn't state exactly what he will celebrate on 31 October - maybe he is just a kid who can't wait to do trick or treat

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By *ikkey69  (M) 1 week ago

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"The Atkins Diet plan has nothing on Boris.

Boris plan, You’ll lose far more than a few pounds.

Whats a few pounds when we get our country back, our fisheries back and 2.7 billion people to trade and prosper with.

Soon be 31st October !!!

You’ll be £1000 richer Mikkey.. don’t forget my pledge on the

other thread. Spend it any way like. "

I dont need your money mikey lol

Please give it to the poor brain dead individuels on here so they can drown their sorrows lol

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 1 week ago

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"The Atkins Diet plan has nothing on Boris.

Boris plan, You’ll lose far more than a few pounds.

Whats a few pounds when we get our country back, our fisheries back and 2.7 billion people to trade and prosper with.

Soon be 31st October !!!

You’ll be £1000 richer Mikkey.. don’t forget my pledge on the

other thread. Spend it any way like.

I dont need your money mikey lol

Please give it to the poor brain dead individuels on here so they can drown their sorrows lol"

He should send it to the leavers to buy fruit

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 1 week ago

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"Chlorinated chicken with ditchwater gravy - mmmm"

That hasn't exactly inspired me for my main meal today. Would I need to wear goggles whilst eating the chicken, like I have to do in chlorinated water/

The ditch water sounds like some of the cheaper, nastier 'real ales' that St Nige spends so much of his time quaffing.

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 1 week ago

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I hear it’s a delicacy in Alabama, homeland of the Trumpites and that film Deliverance

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By *otscot50  (M) 1 week ago

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It is news to me that we aren't actually trading with the rest of the world at present.

So when something says made in China it is actually produced in Europe and our californian wine comes from deep in the Carpathian _ountains.

You will be telling me next that chinese takeaways dont come from China.

Mind you all the brexiteers are good at making up lies that only true brexiteer believers believe.

What it is to have faith in our God given Messiah our exalted and may his name be praised throughout Christendom BOJO

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By *attthew2  (M) 1 week ago

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It’s running true to form . As those who are desperate to leave EU have told me so many times- yawn- it’s simple, just leave. Boris or rather those pulling his strings are a crafty bunch, EU gets the blame for being inflexible whilst protecting its member states (red lines). Lib Dem’s would rather sacrifice the country’s best interests than co operate with Corbyn for a few weeks. Virus will slip through all of this by blaming everyone else (where’s the leadership in that?) then he’ll win a general election and we are headed for a slippery no deal or continue in limbo. Whatever the outcome you can guaranteed that those least able to afford it will pay. Those most able to pay, won’t but will wind up quids in. When will this country grow up?

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*irey_paul By *irey_paul  (M) 1 week ago

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It goes on and all I want is out and no more to can in to the UK that don't want to speak English so don't cum

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 1 week ago

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"It goes on and all I want is out and no more to can in to the UK that don't want to speak English so don't cum"

Too late, they’re already here and taking all the good jobs and speaking da lingo

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 1 week ago

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"It goes on and all I want is out and no more to can in to the UK that don't want to speak English so don't cum"

I've always found that most EU citizens who come to this country can speak quite good English. Often better than the 'indigenous' English. You are probably thinking of the Fuzzy-Wuzzies from Bongobongoland. Or leaving the EU wont make the slightest bit of difference to them coming over

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 1 week ago

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Brexshitter Rule No 1; don’t let facts or really get in the way of a rant

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 1 week ago

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'Fuzzie Wuzzies from Bongobongoland'? I trust you are being ironic by using language that has been outdated since the 50s. Or maybe you are referring to white Australians and Canadians.

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 1 week ago

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"'Fuzzie Wuzzies from Bongobongoland'? I trust you are being ironic by using language that has been outdated since the 50s. Or maybe you are referring to white Australians and Canadians."

I seem to recall that those words were used in the past - not sure if they didn’t belong to a rabid conservative - might have even been the Chief Dipshit himself

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 1 week ago

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I knew I would be stirring up a hornet's nest but just couldn't resist it. I think that expression was used by a leading member [possibly even an MEP] of both Faragist Parties [UKIP and Brexit. A swivel-eyed loon by the name of Godfrey Bloom [ing 'eck]

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By  *ountain    profile verified by photo premium paying member (M) 1 week ago

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Boris has used the fuzzy word. But hes stupid so...

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 1 week ago

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"Boris has used the fuzzy word. But hes stupid so..."

Oh he's far from stupid. May act the clown but very astute, manipulative and frighteningly clever.

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By *attthew2  (M) 1 week ago

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Enough is enough. I find such comments / sentiments extremely offensive.

I truly expect to be ridiculed for saying that but I don’t care. It is racist. Always was racist and smacks of a white suprematist attitude.

Please desist from that kind of language.

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By  *ountain    profile verified by photo premium paying member (M) 1 week ago

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No , he is stupid. Everyone knows wot he is up to. Its blindingly obvious to even you.

And all he is doing is for himself, fuck the country. Im just waiting for Gove to stab him in the back again.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 1 week ago

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"I knew I would be stirring up a hornet's nest but just couldn't resist it. I think that expression was used by a leading member [possibly even an MEP] of both Faragist Parties [UKIP and Brexit. A swivel-eyed loon by the name of Godfrey Bloom [ing 'eck] "

It was Bloom and it was then re-quoted by Bozo. I respectfully suggest that was a very distasteful way to deliberately stir up a hornet's nest. But you do have previous with 'jokes' about people with genetic disorders so maybe something like the n word next?

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 1 week ago

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"Enough is enough. I find such comments / sentiments extremely offensive.

I truly expect to be ridiculed for saying that but I don’t care. It is racist. Always was racist and smacks of a white suprematist attitude.

Please desist from that kind of language. "

I completely agree with you, even if it means we will be told that we don't have a sense of humour. I do have a sense of humour, and I'm sure you do too, but it is not quite that close to the gutter.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 1 week ago

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Was it terribly painful when you all had you sense of humour cut out by blunt, rusty scalpels with no anaesthetic. It's getting very one sided here. If you are not a hard left anti Brexit snowflake then you are clearly not welcome on this forum. Sorry I mean Momentum congress.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 1 week ago

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I already saw that accusation coming. As I said above, I do have a sense of humour but it is not that close to the gutter. It has been one-sided here for a long time to the benefit of the (sometimes extreme) right wing. Refreshing to see a bit more balance for the time being.

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 1 week ago

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"Enough is enough. I find such comments / sentiments extremely offensive.

I truly expect to be ridiculed for saying that but I don’t care. It is racist. Always was racist and smacks of a white suprematist attitude.

Please desist from that kind of language.

I completely agree with you, even if it means we will be told that we don't have a sense of humour. I do have a sense of humour, and I'm sure you do too, but it is not quite that close to the gutter."

Mine’s way lower than that, but it’s just humour

Have you ever heard of Chubby Brown?

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 1 week ago

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"I already saw that accusation coming. As I said above, I do have a sense of humour but it is not that close to the gutter. It has been one-sided here for a long time to the benefit of the (sometimes extreme) right wing. Refreshing to see a bit more balance for the time being."

The usual laughable response. Winter is coming on so mind you don't freeze up there on the moral high ground.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 1 week ago

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Moral high ground is not a bad place to be as opposed to being in the gutter with Bozo and Cummings.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 1 week ago

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Well I can assure you that I am in no gutter nor am I a big fan of Zohnson and I despite Cummings. If you really want to get in the gutter then get down there and wallow with Corbyn, McDonnell Abbott et al.

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 1 week ago

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I find the accusations of racism petty and childish and sanctimonious.

Some people might find it distasteful or believe it to be wrong to quote but that is the same for most humour with the exception of playground jokes.

My long term partner was black so I learned a lot about racism firsthand.

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By  *ountain    profile verified by photo premium paying member (M) 1 week ago

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Me sisters youngest child has two mixed race children, and two nicer kinder lovely children it would be hard to find. Maybey you funny guys ,who havent bad your humour cut off by a politician, would like to practise your hilarious jokes on them.

You would be soooo funny.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 1 week ago

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"Me sisters youngest child has two mixed race children, and two nicer kinder lovely children it would be hard to find. Maybey you funny guys ,who havent bad your humour cut off by a politician, would like to practise your hilarious jokes on them.

You would be soooo funny."

I'm sure all the 'Fuzzie-Wuzzies' referred to are splitting their sides with laughter at the wonderful sophisticated 'humour'.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 1 week ago

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Get a life Mr Boring

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 1 week ago

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That would need to be 'Messrs' as more than one person finds your humour unfunny.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 1 week ago

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As the saying goes "If the cap fit...………."

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*avid93111 By *avid93111  (M) 1 week ago

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Get out ASAP, dictatorial bastards. Others will follow , in time, fed up with dictators in EU

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By *umpyourcum  (M) 1 week ago

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"Me sisters youngest child has two mixed race children, and two nicer kinder lovely children it would be hard to find. Maybey you funny guys ,who havent bad your humour cut off by a politician, would like to practise your hilarious jokes on them.

You would be soooo funny."

So she's got 4 kids ??????

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 1 week ago

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"Get out ASAP, dictatorial bastards. Others will follow , in time, fed up with dictators in EU"

Great move - let’s swap them for corrupt, self serving, womanising lying bastards in London

Great move

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 1 week ago

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"Get out ASAP, dictatorial bastards. Others will follow , in time, fed up with dictators in EU

Great move - let’s swap them for corrupt, self serving, womanising lying bastards in London

Great move"

Womanising??? But he’s got gay hair!

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By  *ountain    profile verified by photo premium paying member (M) 1 week ago

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And hes now blaming everything on the boogie

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 1 week ago

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"And hes now blaming everything on the boogie"

Typical leaver - not his fault.

If it wasn’t so tragic for the UK you’d have to laugh

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 1 week ago

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"Get out ASAP, dictatorial bastards. Others will follow , in time, fed up with dictators in EU"

The only dictatorial bastards at the moment are Bozo and Cummings.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 1 week ago

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"Get out ASAP, dictatorial bastards. Others will follow , in time, fed up with dictators in EU

Great move - let’s swap them for corrupt, self serving, womanising lying bastards in London

Great move"

Oh no? Has Corbyn seized control?

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 1 week ago

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"Get out ASAP, dictatorial bastards. Others will follow , in time, fed up with dictators in EU

Great move - let’s swap them for corrupt, self serving, womanising lying bastards in London

Great move

Oh no? Has Corbyn seized control?"

He’d have a job seizing his dick methinks

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 1 week ago

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"Get out ASAP, dictatorial bastards. Others will follow , in time, fed up with dictators in EU

Great move - let’s swap them for corrupt, self serving, womanising lying bastards in London

Great move

Oh no? Has Corbyn seized control?"

You won't be happy when Diane appears by his side :0

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By *earcher4u  (M) 1 week ago

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I noticed on the news yesterday that Labour's Kier Starmer was again criticising the governments New EU plan anyone can do that, but they have never come up with an alternative plan you never hear Labour saying this is what we should be proposing to the EU simple reason they don't have a plan Corbyn sits on the fence as in many other policies they just don't have a clue

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*9al By *9al  (M) 1 week ago

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Labour would negotiate a customs union deal but are not in power so have to watch the conservatives mess things up trying to appeal to right wing nutters ERG DUP

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 1 week ago

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"I noticed on the news yesterday that Labour's Kier Starmer was again criticising the governments New EU plan anyone can do that, but they have never come up with an alternative plan you never hear Labour saying this is what we should be proposing to the EU simple reason they don't have a plan Corbyn sits on the fence as in many other policies they just don't have a clue "

Labour have cocked up everything they have touched since about 1970 so it's unlikely a sad old geezer like corbyn will change that even if his hard left extremist backers.

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 1 week ago

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The main reason that we have a pathetic and self serving shambles of a government is partly due to the pathetic shambles of an opposition

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 1 week ago

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"The main reason that we have a pathetic and self serving shambles of a government is partly due to the pathetic shambles of an opposition "

That is 100% correct and the most factual statement on this thread

Labour have never been any good in government but in the past they have been bloody awesome in opposition .. it's what they do well. This keeps the incumbent government on their toes.

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By  *ountain    profile verified by photo premium paying member (M) 1 week ago

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The labour party hav been very good in good in government. But britain is a conservative country at heart so keep voting tory. Which allows the capitalistas to destroy all their good work. As in selling off the nhs . Just one of a whole list of social vandalism that they take such pride in. You see see the results of austerity every where now. What was the first thing johnson did . Lower taxes for the rich, no austerity for them. Not blinking likely.

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 1 week ago

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When you look at what the present Labour party want and admire it is a return to the extreme lefy/communist infiltrated party of the 1970s which is something everyone who remembers will have hated every minute of.

Although Blair was labour he was more right leaning than previous leaders but that didnt work either as he decimated the NHS with PFI schemes and a compuer system which lost the country billions of pounds and neither of these schemes worked.

I would like to see less austerity which I think could be brought about with a Tory/LibDem alliance. As for capitalism that is here to stay even if some obscure party took over. it's the degree of capitalism not capitalism itself.

Factually the NHS is NOT being sold off or privatised and no party has ever planned for this. Factually the rich are paying more taxes than ever before and the poor are paying less .. and that is how it should be.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 1 week ago

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"I noticed on the news yesterday that Labour's Kier Starmer was again criticising the governments New EU plan anyone can do that, but they have never come up with an alternative plan you never hear Labour saying this is what we should be proposing to the EU simple reason they don't have a plan Corbyn sits on the fence as in many other policies they just don't have a clue "

It is not the place of the opposition to come up with an alternative plan. The job of the opposition is to scrutinise the government and hold it accountable, which it is doing very well. Labour did make its preferences known when in discussions with May but she was not in listening mode and paid the price.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 1 week ago

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"When you look at what the present Labour party want and admire it is a return to the extreme lefy/communist infiltrated party of the 1970s which is something everyone who remembers will have hated every minute of.

Although Blair was labour he was more right leaning than previous leaders but that didnt work either as he decimated the NHS with PFI schemes and a compuer system which lost the country billions of pounds and neither of these schemes worked.

I would like to see less austerity which I think could be brought about with a Tory/LibDem alliance. As for capitalism that is here to stay even if some obscure party took over. it's the degree of capitalism not capitalism itself.

Factually the NHS is NOT being sold off or privatised and no party has ever planned for this. Factually the rich are paying more taxes than ever before and the poor are paying less .. and that is how it should be."

Governments love to use overall totals when talking about tax but that does not give a true reflection of how the wealthy or poor are affected. If person A has £100 and pays £10, and person B has £1000 and pays £150, the latter is obviously paying more but who is actually better off? A with £90 or B with £850?

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 1 week ago

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"I noticed on the news yesterday that Labour's Kier Starmer was again criticising the governments New EU plan anyone can do that, but they have never come up with an alternative plan you never hear Labour saying this is what we should be proposing to the EU simple reason they don't have a plan Corbyn sits on the fence as in many other policies they just don't have a clue

It is not the place of the opposition to come up with an alternative plan. The job of the opposition is to scrutinise the government and hold it accountable, which it is doing very well. Labour did make its preferences known when in discussions with May but she was not in listening mode and paid the price."

The job of Opposition is to be a viable alternative to the incumbent Government; this is something that it has singularly failed to do.

It’s not primarily there as an auditor but as an alternative if the government fails to command a majority.

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 1 week ago

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"When you look at what the present Labour party want and admire it is a return to the extreme lefy/communist infiltrated party of the 1970s which is something everyone who remembers will have hated every minute of.

Although Blair was labour he was more right leaning than previous leaders but that didnt work either as he decimated the NHS with PFI schemes and a compuer system which lost the country billions of pounds and neither of these schemes worked.

I would like to see less austerity which I think could be brought about with a Tory/LibDem alliance. As for capitalism that is here to stay even if some obscure party took over. it's the degree of capitalism not capitalism itself.

Factually the NHS is NOT being sold off or privatised and no party has ever planned for this. Factually the rich are paying more taxes than ever before and the poor are paying less .. and that is how it should be.

Governments love to use overall totals when talking about tax but that does not give a true reflection of how the wealthy or poor are affected. If person A has £100 and pays £10, and person B has £1000 and pays £150, the latter is obviously paying more but who is actually better off? A with £90 or B with £850?"

The government is better off because it now gets £50 more to distribute to the poor

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 1 week ago

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"When you look at what the present Labour party want and admire it is a return to the extreme lefy/communist infiltrated party of the 1970s which is something everyone who remembers will have hated every minute of.

Although Blair was labour he was more right leaning than previous leaders but that didnt work either as he decimated the NHS with PFI schemes and a compuer system which lost the country billions of pounds and neither of these schemes worked.

I would like to see less austerity which I think could be brought about with a Tory/LibDem alliance. As for capitalism that is here to stay even if some obscure party took over. it's the degree of capitalism not capitalism itself.

Factually the NHS is NOT being sold off or privatised and no party has ever planned for this. Factually the rich are paying more taxes than ever before and the poor are paying less .. and that is how it should be."

Absolutely correct. Trouble is we have not experienced a proper Labour government for 40 years so it is only we 'oldies' who remember the dire state the country was in. The thing is the world has moved on. In those 40 years the communist block countries have fallen and are now embracing democracy and capitalism in some shape or form. Socialist and Social Democrat parties in most countries now have moved away from the old leftist ideology whereas our crazy Labour party has taken a retro lurch to the hard left.

The only political party that has ever talked about selling off the NHS is the Faragista Party Mk 1 aka UKIP and they are all but dead in the water. Claims that the Conservatives are planning to sell it off are nothing but very desperate Labour propaganda.

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 1 week ago

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I think it’s also ‘convenient ‘ propaganda by the remoaners who are scaremongering (as opposed to remainers who I have respect for having an alternative view)

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By *ayMan007   profile verified by photo (M) 1 week ago

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"When you look at what the present Labour party want and admire it is a return to the extreme lefy/communist infiltrated party of the 1970s which is something everyone who remembers will have hated every minute of.

Although Blair was labour he was more right leaning than previous leaders but that didnt work either as he decimated the NHS with PFI schemes and a compuer system which lost the country billions of pounds and neither of these schemes worked.

I would like to see less austerity which I think could be brought about with a Tory/LibDem alliance. As for capitalism that is here to stay even if some obscure party took over. it's the degree of capitalism not capitalism itself.

Factually the NHS is NOT being sold off or privatised and no party has ever planned for this. Factually the rich are paying more taxes than ever before and the poor are paying less .. and that is how it should be."

What does 'lefy' mean?

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 1 week ago

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"When you look at what the present Labour party want and admire it is a return to the extreme lefy/communist infiltrated party of the 1970s which is something everyone who remembers will have hated every minute of.

Although Blair was labour he was more right leaning than previous leaders but that didnt work either as he decimated the NHS with PFI schemes and a compuer system which lost the country billions of pounds and neither of these schemes worked.

I would like to see less austerity which I think could be brought about with a Tory/LibDem alliance. As for capitalism that is here to stay even if some obscure party took over. it's the degree of capitalism not capitalism itself.

Factually the NHS is NOT being sold off or privatised and no party has ever planned for this. Factually the rich are paying more taxes than ever before and the poor are paying less .. and that is how it should be.

Governments love to use overall totals when talking about tax but that does not give a true reflection of how the wealthy or poor are affected. If person A has £100 and pays £10, and person B has £1000 and pays £150, the latter is obviously paying more but who is actually better off? A with £90 or B with £850?

The government is better off because it now gets £50 more to distribute to the poor"

As if a Tory government has ever seen an extra bit of revenue as something to give to the poor! More likely to be austerity for the bottom tiers and tax cuts for the upper echelons. Anything extra would be distributed to the rich under the Tories, while claiming that 'we're all in this together'.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 1 week ago

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"

What does 'lefy' mean?"

It's the opposite of righy.

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 1 week ago

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"

What does 'lefy' mean?

It's the opposite of righy. "

Brexit has stolen some consonants

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By *ugbydad  (M) 1 week ago

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I've deliberately kept off these Brexit forums for a week or two, because events are happening far too quickly, to the point where by the time you have posted something the situation has changed completely. One comment from 'Mountain' four hours ago intrigued me though. 'Labour governments have been good for this country' In what way exactly? Would love to hear some examples of that.

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By *obbo-bi1  (M) 1 week ago

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Try the NHS. The benefits system, Paid Holidays, I could go on if you wish

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 1 week ago

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"Try the NHS. The benefits system, Paid Holidays, I could go on if you wish "

The NHS was an all party concept which evolved during the war when treating wounded servicemen became a national necessity.

The benefits system was introduced by the Liberal Party.

Paid holidays were introduced under Chamberlain, Conservative.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 1 week ago

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"Try the NHS. The benefits system, Paid Holidays, I could go on if you wish

The NHS was an all party concept which evolved during the war when treating wounded servicemen became a national necessity.

The benefits system was introduced by the Liberal Party.

Paid holidays were introduced under Chamberlain, Conservative. "

All true. The post wat Attlee government may have been good for the country at the time but I'm not so sure that any Labour government has achieved much since. Certainly the last real Labour government under Sunny Jim Callaghan completely lost control of the country

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By *ugbydad  (M) 1 week ago

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I would have laid thousands of pounds on the NHS being given as the first response to my earlier message, robbo-bil. You didn't disappoint.

Thankfully i see Mikey 1973 got in before me to shoot down the lies and misinformation peddled about the introduction of the NHS by the Labour Party. I speak as one who had personal experience of what the NHS was like in 2001, which allowed a previously healthy 43 year old man die suddenly from cancer. Which party was in 2001?? Why, Tony B-lair's Labour party of course. How do I know? the man who dies was my late partner.

The Benefits system? Yes it's really clever creating a society where people are happier to stay on the dole and claim benefits instead of going out and doing a days work.

Paid Holidays?? Yes, that's really useful if you want to be an idle left wing protestor, whose idea of fun is to block our streets and spend their days off massively inconveniencing the hard working general public from going about their daily business and causing millions of pounds of damage to our economy.

So you are proud of those achievements are you robbo-bil. Forgive me if I take exception to your viewpoint.

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By  *ountain    profile verified by photo premium paying member (M) 1 week ago

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Why are private hospitals allowed to register as a charity while the nhs hospital council 'rent ' is increased by the tory landlords. Hmm i wonder why ! The open university..free education for everyone when they need or want it. A triumph of

the best sort of helping people .

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 1 week ago

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Since when was the Open University [a brainchild of the Wilson government] free?

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 1 week ago

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That’s a good question. All hospitals pay business rates including private hospitals. It is true that around 25% of private hospitals were granted charitable status saving a lot on business rates.

Nothing to do with Tory or Labour as the same rules and conditions have applied during both governments.

Obviously the hospitals which are granted charitable status have to provide some charitable services and this is often in tending children or specialised operations.

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By  *ountain    profile verified by photo premium paying member (M) 7 days ago

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It was always free til the tories saw it helping

working class people.

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 7 days ago

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" It was always free til the tories saw it helping

working class people. "

Wrong again young sir. You should take a OUNcourse if British history lol.

The OU was founded by Wilson (Labour) but really came into operation around the time of Heath (Conservative) and both parties have made many improvements over the years as technology has evolved.

Since 2013, Cameron (Conservative) the OU has set up a MOOC platform called FutureLearn which is now the UK's largest provider of free online courses.

Ardent brexiteers will hate the OU as it provides for anyone around the world. . Stiff upper lip and all that.

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 7 days ago

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" It was always free til the tories saw it helping

working class people.

Wrong again young sir. You should take a OUNcourse if British history lol.

The OU was founded by Wilson (Labour) but really came into operation around the time of Heath (Conservative) and both parties have made many improvements over the years as technology has evolved.

Since 2013, Cameron (Conservative) the OU has set up a MOOC platform called FutureLearn which is now the UK's largest provider of free online courses.

Ardent brexiteers will hate the OU as it provides for anyone around the world. . Stiff upper lip and all that. "

Ardent brexiteers will hate it because it educates people and shows bigots up for what they are. A bit like Ree-Smogg who is fixated by the class system of the Victorians

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 7 days ago

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Just to confirm, the EHIC (European Health Insurance Card) will no longer be valid after 31st October, when we leave the EU. So, stock up on your own Health Insurance, you're almost on your own.

The government has asked all 31 countries to keep EHICs in use until 31 December 2020, no matter what happens with Brexit. Only three have agreed to cover UK tourists if there's no deal; this would mean prices will go up, especially for people with existing health problems.

The government has made it very clear that it wants EHIC to continue, deal or no deal. Only Spain has agreed to that.

It amazes me that this bunch of westminster oiks have the gall to walk out of the EU, putting two fingers up, and then INSIST on things being as normal.

What a bunch of nobbers - almost as bad as the entertainers on this site

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*urball By *urball  (M) 7 days ago

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"Ardent brexiteers will hate it because it educates people and shows bigots up for what they are. A bit like Ree-Smogg who is fixated by the class system of the Victorians"

Are we talking about the "philanthropist white saviour" Victorians who justified colonialism as bringing civilization and education to the poor unwashed masses of the world? I bet they would have loved the OU online.

I've got to say I'm astounded to learn that in 2019 the rest of the world still hasn't managed to organize their own education, online or otherwise, and still rely on a British institution. It's lucky they somehow have the internet to be able to access it isn't it?

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By *arits   premium paying member (TV/TS/CD) 7 days ago

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If anyone thinks that the benefits of a modern welfare state would have been achieved without the need to contain the aspirations of the working class they really are living in cloud cuckoo land.

In this country, for better or worse, those aspirations came to be formally embodied in the Labour party.

As for the NHS, the midwife at its very painful birth was a socialist, Aneurin Bevan. If one person is responsible for delivering it, it was him. The fact that is now a fetish for all parties shows how skilful he was at that job.

As for the Open University, look at this tribute to his wife,who as Labour Arts Minister, brought it forward.

"So if you've ever had your interest sparked by an Open University course, it's Jennie Lee, the disarming renegade MP who once outraged the Commons Chamber “as she entered in a clinging emerald velvet evening dress” that you have to thank for it"

Source? That socialist rag The Daily Telegraph.

Conservatives can take comfort from Gordon Brown's discovery in Caabinet papers that when her Treasury tried to starve it off funds in its early days, Margaret Thatcher spoke up for it and over-ruled her Chancellor.

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*urball By *urball  (M) 7 days ago

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Does anyone else find it strange that a majority of Labour constituencies voted leave in the Referendum? That means there are loads of "Brexit bigots" who also vote Labour? It also means there are lots of Labour MPs who are failing to represent their constituents.

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By *attthew2  (M) 7 days ago

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"Does anyone else find it strange that a majority of Labour constituencies voted leave in the Referendum? That means there are loads of "Brexit bigots" who also vote Labour? It also means there are lots of Labour MPs who are failing to represent their constituents."

Calling people nasty names wont really help when it comes to getting your opinions across to people who have a different idea to you. Calling people names reveals more about you than it does about them. But I guess you already know that.

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By *arits   premium paying member (TV/TS/CD) 7 days ago

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"Does anyone else find it strange that a majority of Labour constituencies voted leave in the Referendum? That means there are loads of "Brexit bigots" who also vote Labour? It also means there are lots of Labour MPs who are failing to represent their constituents."

Really? Gosh, which party leader was the one who was least enthusiastic about Remain!

Your observation shows just why the maligned Jeremy Corbin, target of so many assassination attempts by those behind him, deserves recognition asthe only party leader to try and reconcile the "irreconcilables". Perhaps not an effective leader, sadly.

You also misunderstand the duty of an MP. They are charged with using their best judgement, not with putting forward the views of their constituents

"Members of the House of Commons hold, in effect, a triple mandate. They represent all the people of their constituency, their party and the interests of the country. It is a tenet of representative democracy that MPs are not delegates for their constituents. This means that, while the views of constituents are frequently considered, the actions of MPs are governed by their determination of the best interests of their constituency, their party and the country as a whole." Politics.co.uk

Given that Remain was a simple choice of known knowns but Leave a complex one involving known unknowns and as we now see, unknown unknowns, perhaps all the MPs are to be forgiven for not taking the Leave majority as voting for one simple thing for one simple reason. Because they didn't.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 7 days ago

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"Does anyone else find it strange that a majority of Labour constituencies voted leave in the Referendum? That means there are loads of "Brexit bigots" who also vote Labour? It also means there are lots of Labour MPs who are failing to represent their constituents."

Okay we were given the chance to return a 'Brexit Parliament' in 2017 but we didn't. The thing is a general election is not a single issue affair [unless you are an adherent to the Brexit Party] People vote how they do for a number of reasons, not least who they think is best suited to govern the country over the next five years. There is also an amount of traditional how people vote and this is often deeply entrenched in safe seats of any party.

Do you vote for the person who is standing in your constituency, the party, the party leader, the major issues of the day or whatever. There is also a lot of 'negative' voting whereby people vote against a particular party/government.

Prime example of this was a conversation I had one night with two guys from a Welsh Valleys town. They were being quite rude and homophobic about their MP who happens to be gay. So I asked them how they would vote in the next election. Their reply was something on the lines of "Well we'll have the vote for the f****Ig p**f 'cos he's Labour isn't he"

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 7 days ago

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"Does anyone else find it strange that a majority of Labour constituencies voted leave in the Referendum? That means there are loads of "Brexit bigots" who also vote Labour? It also means there are lots of Labour MPs who are failing to represent their constituents.

Calling people nasty names wont really help when it comes to getting your opinions across to people who have a different idea to you. Calling people names reveals more about you than it does about them. But I guess you already know that.

"

You sound a bit of a sensitive soul. People get called a lot worse than bigots.Some go out of their way to be rude about certain politicians. And yes I admit I've done it.

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*urball By *urball  (M) 7 days ago

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"Calling people nasty names wont really help when it comes to getting your opinions across to people who have a different idea to you. Calling people names reveals more about you than it does about them. But I guess you already know that."

Are you sure? Many people that I have talked to since the referendum have admitted they voted remain because so much of the narrative at the time was that voting leave meant they were racist or a bigot.

They might not have been directly calling people racist but that was the implication and it influenced some people. Even now there is a strong narrative from the Remainers that Brexiters are racists and/or bigots.

Anyway, I wasn't actually calling anyone names, hence the "", I chose the phrasing to draw attention to the fact that this isn't a political right v left issue. It's interesting how people responded.

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*urball By *urball  (M) 7 days ago

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" You also misunderstand the duty of an MP. They are charged with using their best judgement, not with putting forward the views of their constituents

"Members of the House of Commons hold, in effect, a triple mandate. They represent all the people of their constituency, their party and the interests of the country."

So after the referendum when the results show that their constituents voted leave as a majority, the country voted leave as a majority and on Labours own website it says "Labour accepts the referendum result" who exactly are the Remain Labour MPs representing other than themselves?

It is arrogant to assume that people didn't know/understand what they were voting for. What wasn't clear about the referendum? Accepting the risk of the unknowns was implicit in voting to change the status quo. People decided it was not "better the devil you know" and chose uncertainty.

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 7 days ago

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"Brexiters are racists and/or bigots"

It would be ridiculous to state that but it would be accurate to state that there are more racists who want to leave than remain. It was said at the time of the referendum that many racists were jumping on the Brexit bandwagon and using it as an excuse for their bigotry.

Now we know that was indeed the result as police forces throughout the country have had substantial rises in race crimes and evidence has shown it to be Brexit related.

this does not in any way reflect on the honest and decent people who voted to leave. Thay cannot be responsible for those jumping on the bandwagon.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 7 days ago

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I think there is some evidence to say that not all Leavers are racist (xenophobic) but all racists are Leavers.

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 7 days ago

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" You also misunderstand the duty of an MP. They are charged with using their best judgement, not with putting forward the views of their constituents

"Members of the House of Commons hold, in effect, a triple mandate. They represent all the people of their constituency, their party and the interests of the country.

So after the referendum when the results show that their constituents voted leave as a majority, the country voted leave as a majority and on Labours own website it says "Labour accepts the referendum result" who exactly are the Remain Labour MPs representing other than themselves?

It is arrogant to assume that people didn't know/understand what they were voting for. What wasn't clear about the referendum? Accepting the risk of the unknowns was implicit in voting to change the status quo. People decided it was not "better the devil you know" and chose uncertainty."

So why is there so much resistance by leavers to a second referendum when, in your view, everyone KNEW what they were voting for and aren’t likely to change their mind.

Oh, I know. It’s because they lost and we won.

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By *arits   premium paying member (TV/TS/CD) 7 days ago

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" You also misunderstand the duty of an MP. They are charged with using their best judgement, not with putting forward the views of their constituents

"Members of the House of Commons hold, in effect, a triple mandate. They represent all the people of their constituency, their party and the interests of the country.

So after the referendum when the results show that their constituents voted leave as a majority, the country voted leave as a majority and on Labours own website it says "Labour accepts the referendum result" who exactly are the Remain Labour MPs representing other than themselves?

It is arrogant to assume that people didn't know/understand what they were voting for. What wasn't clear about the referendum? Accepting the risk of the unknowns was implicit in voting to change the status quo. People decided it was not "better the devil you know" and chose uncertainty."

Well, you have made my point for me. If voters chose "uncertainty" they should not be surprised if the people who have the job of actually implementing the change disagree on what to do to make what happens reasonably certain.

To make it certain, for example, that your medicines arrive, the Pound in your pocket retains its value(woops, gone already), that our exports can be sent abroad at a profit, that food gets to the your table. Etc etc.

The true arrogance is when we are told we are obstructive traitors for wanting actually to see a plan rather than more piffle from de Pfeffel.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 7 days ago

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" You also misunderstand the duty of an MP. They are charged with using their best judgement, not with putting forward the views of their constituents

"Members of the House of Commons hold, in effect, a triple mandate. They represent all the people of their constituency, their party and the interests of the country.

So after the referendum when the results show that their constituents voted leave as a majority, the country voted leave as a majority and on Labours own website it says "Labour accepts the referendum result" who exactly are the Remain Labour MPs representing other than themselves?

It is arrogant to assume that people didn't know/understand what they were voting for. What wasn't clear about the referendum? Accepting the risk of the unknowns was implicit in voting to change the status quo. People decided it was not "better the devil you know" and chose uncertainty.

Well, you have made my point for me. If voters chose "uncertainty" they should not be surprised if the people who have the job of actually implementing the change disagree on what to do to make what happens reasonably certain.

To make it certain, for example, that your medicines arrive, the Pound in your pocket retains its value(woops, gone already), that our exports can be sent abroad at a profit, that food gets to the your table. Etc etc.

The true arrogance is when we are told we are obstructive traitors for wanting actually to see a plan rather than more piffle from de Pfeffel."

Well said

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 7 days ago

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"

So why is there so much resistance by leavers to a second referendum when, in your view, everyone KNEW what they were voting for and aren’t likely to change their mind.

Oh, I know. It’s because they lost and we won.

"

I cannot answer that on behalf of all the Brexiteers but I can answer that for myself and myself alone.

This whole sordid Brexit business has gone on too long and needs sorting asap. If we have another referendum we are going to be subjected to another acrimonious and divisive campaign. More distortions of the truth [we are not allowed to say lies] more scaremongering and from BOTH sides.

Then comes the vote itself and who can predict the outcome. Anything short of at least 60% Victory from one side or other will be divisive rather than decisive. If Brexit wins again the extreme Remainers wont accept it again plus will we be then subjected to more years of negotiating and extensions.

If Remain wins the Faragists will raise their ugly head yet again claiming they were robbed and start campaigning for yet another referendum. And so it goes on.

I voted to leave last time and, although I've often wondered if I made the wrong decision, I would vote to leave again but I hope it does not come to that.

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*atamite By *atamite  (M) 7 days ago

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"I think there is some evidence to say that not all Leavers are racist (xenophobic) but all racists are Leavers."

As Richard Pryor once joked, "I don't think all Italians are in the Mafia..... but everyone in the Mafia is Italian."

But there is a huge streak of xenophobia within the Brexit movement. It's hard to deny when you have Leave.eu just on Tuesday saying, "We didn't win two world wars just to be bossed around by a Kraut.", in reference to Angela Merkel. If that's what they're saying on the official posters, imagine what they're saying behind closed doors.

Could you imagine if some pro-EU group came out with a poster that called the British Rosbifs or Tommies? Nigel Farage would be swinging from the rafters over it, going absolutely berserk.

I'm certainly not saying that every Brexiteer is a xenophobe - there are different reasons why people voted to leave - but to say it's not present in the 17.4 million is quite a claim.

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By *iwmwales  (M) 7 days ago

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"I think there is some evidence to say that not all Leavers are racist (xenophobic) but all racists are Leavers.

As Richard Pryor once joked, "I don't think all Italians are in the Mafia..... but everyone in the Mafia is Italian."

But there is a huge streak of xenophobia within the Brexit movement. It's hard to deny when you have Leave.eu just on Tuesday saying, "We didn't win two world wars just to be bossed around by a Kraut.", in reference to Angela Merkel. If that's what they're saying on the official posters, imagine what they're saying behind closed doors.

Could you imagine if some pro-EU group came out with a poster that called the British Rosbifs or Tommies? Nigel Farage would be swinging from the rafters over it, going absolutely berserk.

I'm certainly not saying that every Brexiteer is a xenophobe - there are different reasons why people voted to leave - but to say it's not present in the 17.4 million is quite a claim. "

Is it racist to believe that the country"s citizens should have priority? If they don't what is the point of citizenship?

Laws of supply and demand dictate that if there are far more applicants than jobs the pay goes down; the reverse of course is if there are more jobs that people the pay goes up. British Citizens who have wives, children, families and mortgages cannot live on the same money as foreigners (single but grouped together to pay costs); economic fact.

What about the community life that used to exist, all being diluted. People do become resentful when their historical community is lost.

Britain does need immigrants but the immigrants (who intend to reside here permanently) need to integrate into British society, British society should be in no way obligated to adapt to immigrants.

So while some leavers (some remainers also) are xenophobic they are an insignificant minority. AND wagging your finger and screaming racist at people with genuine concerns will create silent resentment and the Elites will not see events coming such as ..... BREXIT.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 7 days ago

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Who will you blame for problems that exist after Brexit? It will be difficult to blame things on the EU and immigrants ... and xenophobia will continue anyway.

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*atamite By *atamite  (M) 7 days ago

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"I think there is some evidence to say that not all Leavers are racist (xenophobic) but all racists are Leavers.

As Richard Pryor once joked, "I don't think all Italians are in the Mafia..... but everyone in the Mafia is Italian."

But there is a huge streak of xenophobia within the Brexit movement. It's hard to deny when you have Leave.eu just on Tuesday saying, "We didn't win two world wars just to be bossed around by a Kraut.", in reference to Angela Merkel. If that's what they're saying on the official posters, imagine what they're saying behind closed doors.

Could you imagine if some pro-EU group came out with a poster that called the British Rosbifs or Tommies? Nigel Farage would be swinging from the rafters over it, going absolutely berserk.

I'm certainly not saying that every Brexiteer is a xenophobe - there are different reasons why people voted to leave - but to say it's not present in the 17.4 million is quite a claim.

Is it racist to believe that the country"s citizens should have priority? If they don't what is the point of citizenship?

Laws of supply and demand dictate that if there are far more applicants than jobs the pay goes down; the reverse of course is if there are more jobs that people the pay goes up. British Citizens who have wives, children, families and mortgages cannot live on the same money as foreigners (single but grouped together to pay costs); economic fact.

What about the community life that used to exist, all being diluted. People do become resentful when their historical community is lost.

Britain does need immigrants but the immigrants (who intend to reside here permanently) need to integrate into British society, British society should be in no way obligated to adapt to immigrants.

So while some leavers (some remainers also) are xenophobic they are an insignificant minority. AND wagging your finger and screaming racist at people with genuine concerns will create silent resentment and the Elites will not see events coming such as ..... BREXIT."

I think you're taking what I'm saying a bit wrong. I'm not saying that concerns over immigration are invalid, but I object to the boneheaded sloganeering of Leave.eu, and the 'two World Wars and one World Cup, doo-dah, doo-dah' brigade. The yobs who aren't really interested in having a reasoned conversation, led by the charlatans who know how to stir up the rubes. The barstoolers who have no time for statistics which contradict their anecdotal evidence. The ex-pats living out in Spain 20 years without ever learning a word of the local language, or having any interest in integrating whatsoever. It's those in the Brexit movement given to ignorance, blind prejudice or British exceptionalism.

On the other hand, as I say, there is a reasoned conversation to be had about immigration. I understand that a lot of British people feel a secret dismay over how their communities have changed around them in the last few decades. Something they might have felt ashamed to express because of the accusations of racism they might face. What I would say about this is that Brexit may be (in part) an expression of the anger felt about this. I don't it'll do much to change the situation for in this regard, though. Fewer foreigners may come, although there'll be plenty already there who'll remain. I wonder that if and when Brexit happens, and the hoopla dies down, and the ordinary Brexit voter notices that their lives haven't really gotten better, where does their anger go then?

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 7 days ago

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Nicely put Mr Catamite

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By *ALLBIMALE52   premium paying member (TV/TS/CD) 7 days ago

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A lot of guys who favour remain on here conveniently forgetting what the Lisbon Treaty binds us to if we remain. So in response to those who trot out the party line of “we didn’t know what we were voting for” , maybe we didn’t know the full details of what we voted out for, but neither were the full details of the Lisbon Treaty made public at the time. Oh and remember the “ there are no plans for a European army”,. Why does a “trading partnership “ need an army?

Putin will never allow a German lead EU , especially with its own army, to expand further east. Hell, the Russian PEOPLE won’t allow it. We might have short memories in this country but the Russians certainly don’t. There is absolutely no political correctness when it comes to commemorating the victory over Germany, they hate the Germans with a passion. I saw it first hand when I worked there.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 6 days ago

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Interesting. Just heard Farage on local radio. He admits he has changed his mind since the referendum - from Norway-style or Canada-style arrangements to no deal. Strange that he allows himself the option to change his mind but denies that to anyone else, unless it means changing to become an advocate of no deal!

Although he doesn't have the details, he is also already against any potential 'breakthrough' yesterday. Just shows yet again how much credence he has.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 6 days ago

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I don't normally pay much heed to the Farage Party Mk 2 with Nigel's drunken rants and Widders' senile diatribes. However I was quite impressed with a speech by MEP Belinda De Lucy who politely but firmly gave that creep Barnier a sound ticking off for 'negotiating with the pompous little Bercow

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 6 days ago

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They seem to be trotting her out at every opportunity as their younger 'acceptable' face. Every time I have seen her she has come across as an aggressive bimbo just spouting rehearsed soundbites.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 6 days ago

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First time I had even been aware of the existence of Ms De Lucy. Then again I tend not to follow her rather vacuous party or the equally vacuous European Parliament. She looked smart rather than bimbo-ish and I didn't think she sounded aggressive. Very different to some politician who look as if they have just come off the catwalk at a jumble sale and rant and rave incoherently.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 6 days ago

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"First time I had even been aware of the existence of Ms De Lucy. Then again I tend not to follow her rather vacuous party or the equally vacuous European Parliament. She looked smart rather than bimbo-ish and I didn't think she sounded aggressive. Very different to some politician who look as if they have just come off the catwalk at a jumble sale and rant and rave incoherently."

Nor do I follow them - but she has been interviewed several times for news broadcasts and has appeared on panel shows as their representative. You may have seen her on a good day when she felt comfortable surrounded by her buddies? When there is someone who challenges her she slips into rehearsed soundbites and delivers them very aggressively.

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By *attthew2  (M) 6 days ago

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? ?? ???????? ???????? ?????!

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 6 days ago

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"First time I had even been aware of the existence of Ms De Lucy. Then again I tend not to follow her rather vacuous party or the equally vacuous European Parliament. She looked smart rather than bimbo-ish and I didn't think she sounded aggressive. Very different to some politician who look as if they have just come off the catwalk at a jumble sale and rant and rave incoherently.

Nor do I follow them - but she has been interviewed several times for news broadcasts and has appeared on panel shows as their representative. You may have seen her on a good day when she felt comfortable surrounded by her buddies? When there is someone who challenges her she slips into rehearsed soundbites and delivers them very aggressively."

I quite often slip into a rehearsed sound bite, but I find that it chafes in all the wrong places

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*atamite By *atamite  (M) 6 days ago

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Looks like Johnson is preparing to make an agreement that disregards the protestations of the DUP. Let's see how this develops.

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 6 days ago

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"Looks like Johnson is preparing to make an agreement that disregards the protestations of the DUP. Let's see how this develops. "

Can a minority government make agreements?

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*atamite By *atamite  (M) 6 days ago

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"Looks like Johnson is preparing to make an agreement that disregards the protestations of the DUP. Let's see how this develops.

Can a minority government make agreements?"

It's not whether they can make agreements. It's whether they can get it through parliament. That's always been the hurdle.

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 6 days ago

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"Looks like Johnson is preparing to make an agreement that disregards the protestations of the DUP. Let's see how this develops.

Can a minority government make agreements?

It's not whether they can make agreements. It's whether they can get it through parliament. That's always been the hurdle. "

So, anything that upsets the DUP is already on the back foot. Cheers

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 6 days ago

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Just seen the brilliant James Mylne portrait of Bozo as The Joker - very apt as he used to be comical years ago but now is very sinister and just uses the clown persona as a mask.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 6 days ago

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One of the best caricatures I've seen recently of Jezbollah Corbyn was him in the guise of Pied Piper leading hoards of gullible students, to their doom, with false promises of getting rid of tuition fees and a 'brave new world'.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 6 days ago

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"One of the best caricatures I've seen recently of Jezbollah Corbyn was him in the guise of Pied Piper leading hoards of gullible students, to their doom, with false promises of getting rid of tuition fees and a 'brave new world'."

Usual deflection but what do you think of the portrait of Bozo as The Joker? I think it catches his character beautifully.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 6 days ago

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I knew it wouldn't take long for the honourable member for East Kent to reply.

To date I have not seen this so-called portrait of Boris Zohnson.

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*atamite By *atamite  (M) 6 days ago

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"Looks like Johnson is preparing to make an agreement that disregards the protestations of the DUP. Let's see how this develops.

Can a minority government make agreements?

It's not whether they can make agreements. It's whether they can get it through parliament. That's always been the hurdle.

So, anything that upsets the DUP is already on the back foot. Cheers "

The DUP doesn't matter at this stage - his government has made so many enemies, and his party is so divided that a majority might vote it down just on principle.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 6 days ago

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It does sound like he is throwing the DUP under the bus ... but maybe they can smell another 'sweetener' (bribe) in the offing?

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 6 days ago

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If we don’t like something we call it a bribe LOLOL.

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 6 days ago

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"It does sound like he is throwing the DUP under the bus ... but maybe they can smell another 'sweetener' (bribe) in the offing?"

You can call it anything you want but the DUP is just making the most of the circumstances with a piss poor and weak government in place

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 6 days ago

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"If we don’t like something we call it a bribe LOLOL. "

A bribe by any other name is still a bribe.

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 6 days ago

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"If we don’t like something we call it a bribe LOLOL.

A bribe by any other name is still a bribe."

What’s blackmail then?

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 6 days ago

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"If we don’t like something we call it a bribe LOLOL.

A bribe by any other name is still a bribe."

I wonder what it would be if, by some catastrophic chance, Labour came out the largest party at the next election but had to do a deal with the SNP to stay in power. Of course any financial sweeteners then could possibly be described as a bribe

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 6 days ago

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"If we don’t like something we call it a bribe LOLOL.

A bribe by any other name is still a bribe."

But it isn’t is it. With that logic every promise made by anyone could be described as a bribe. Every gain for the public would be a bribe. Every incentive would be a bribe. Nobody would be able to offer anyone anything LOLOL.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 6 days ago

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"If we don’t like something we call it a bribe LOLOL.

A bribe by any other name is still a bribe.

I wonder what it would be if, by some catastrophic chance, Labour came out the largest party at the next election but had to do a deal with the SNP to stay in power. Of course any financial sweeteners then could possibly be described as a bribe "

Of course it would be a bribe but May set the precedent so all bribes now are fair and can be called a 'confidence and supply' agreement. I don't share your view that two wrongs make a right. What's wrong for the Tories is wrong for any party and vice versa. I'm surprised you even think there is a chance of Labour getting into power - in your eyes the Tories seem to be getting everything right so they must be a shoo-in.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 6 days ago

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"If we don’t like something we call it a bribe LOLOL.

A bribe by any other name is still a bribe.

What’s blackmail then?"

Blackmail is akin to what the DUP demanded for their support.

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 6 days ago

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It’s got nothing to do with whether it’s offered by Tories or Labour. Both parties do similar deals all the time. We don’t call it a bribe every time just when it annoys us or we don’t approve.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 6 days ago

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"It’s got nothing to do with whether it’s offered by Tories or Labour. Both parties do similar deals all the time. We don’t call it a bribe every time just when it annoys us or we don’t approve. "

I assume that is the royal 'we' as you certainly don't speak for me.

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 6 days ago

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"It’s got nothing to do with whether it’s offered by Tories or Labour. Both parties do similar deals all the time. We don’t call it a bribe every time just when it annoys us or we don’t approve.

I assume that is the royal 'we' as you certainly don't speak for me."

Too working class to know anything of you blue bloods. I simply meant “we” as in the masses of normal people

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 6 days ago

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That is quite a claim - the spokesperson of the masses, like Bozo is the man of the people. I'm not a blue blood - that is another user

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 6 days ago

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"It’s got nothing to do with whether it’s offered by Tories or Labour. Both parties do similar deals all the time. We don’t call it a bribe every time just when it annoys us or we don’t approve.

I assume that is the royal 'we' as you certainly don't speak for me.

Too working class to know anything of you blue bloods. I simply meant “we” as in the masses of normal people "

On a gay and bisexual website you dare to use the ‘n’ word?

How very dare you

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 6 days ago

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"

Of course it would be a bribe but May set the precedent so all bribes now are fair and can be called a 'confidence and supply' agreement. I don't share your view that two wrongs make a right. What's wrong for the Tories is wrong for any party and vice versa. I'm surprised you even think there is a chance of Labour getting into power - in your eyes the Tories seem to be getting everything right so they must be a shoo-in."

I don't believe two wrongs make a right but you can't blame one without the other. Ian Blackmark---or whatever Wee Nicola's puppet in Westminster is called---stated the other day that a 2nd referendum plus 'other considerations' would be required for SNP support for a future Labour government.

As for elections nothing is a foregone conclusion. I cannot believe that the country would be so stupid as to elect Jezbollah and his mob but with our outdated electoral system anything could happen by default.

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*atamite By *atamite  (M) 5 days ago

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That's how it works when parties go into coalition . The supporting parties has demands they make in return.

However, in the case of the DUP and their C&S agreement, the Conservatives have been very much seen to take sides in Northern Ireland, and that was something that was pledged would not happen. It was supposed to be a neutral arbiter.

And the funny thing is that the extra ten votes it got the Conservatives are now next to worthless in any vote that runs along Government/Opposition lines. Karma there, I think.

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By  *ountain    profile verified by photo premium paying member (M) 5 days ago

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Ill accept 1,000 pounds to change my vote.

Im cheap, or so all the men say. So bozo ,get in touch. xxx

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 5 days ago

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This old chestnut of the DUP and the C&S agreement could be argued over forever more. After the unsatisfactory result of the 2017 election what alternative did the government have? Risk a minority government being voted down at every turn? There was no chance of the Conservatives going into coalition or reaching an 'understanding' with any other party. The only answer now is a general election but even that cannot be guaranteed to bring a satisfactory result.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 5 days ago

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"This old chestnut of the DUP and the C&S agreement could be argued over forever more. After the unsatisfactory result of the 2017 election what alternative did the government have? Risk a minority government being voted down at every turn? There was no chance of the Conservatives going into coalition or reaching an 'understanding' with any other party. The only answer now is a general election but even that cannot be guaranteed to bring a satisfactory result."

But of course it was 'right' to get into bed with such a nasty bunch in a Tory's eyes. But anyone who defends that option should logically support any potential deal between Labour and the SNP, on the basis of what's sauce for the goose ...

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 5 days ago

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If Labour came out of a general election as the top party but with no majority I would expect them to do a deal with the SNP, in order to form a stable government, however distasteful it would be to me. I would also expect them to make concessions to their new Scottish friends. I would like to think the SNP might curb some of Labour's crazier ideas but they are pretty crazy themselves.

I was never happy about the Conservative/DUP alliance but it seemed to be the only logical thing to do at the time. With all due respect to the good people of Northern Ireland, they want to stay part of the UK [so we are led to believe] they do send some pretty horrendous politicians to Westminster. The exception, of course, being Lady Sylvia Hermon.

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*atamite By *atamite  (M) 5 days ago

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"If Labour came out of a general election as the top party but with no majority I would expect them to do a deal with the SNP, in order to form a stable government, however distasteful it would be to me. I would also expect them to make concessions to their new Scottish friends. I would like to think the SNP might curb some of Labour's crazier ideas but they are pretty crazy themselves.

I was never happy about the Conservative/DUP alliance but it seemed to be the only logical thing to do at the time. With all due respect to the good people of Northern Ireland, they want to stay part of the UK [so we are led to believe] they do send some pretty horrendous politicians to Westminster. The exception, of course, being Lady Sylvia Hermon. "

It's not the same thing at all. Boris was up in front of the DUP only a couple of weeks ago saying, "Northern Ireland is a part of the UK and let it remain so forever! Let it remain so forever!" This is a ridiculous thing to say because the UK had agreed to be neutral on the constitutional status of Northern Ireland, as did the Irish government, which is why it revoked its claim on the territory. This was an arrangement that not only Blair and Brown's Labour had stuck to, but also that Cameron's government respected. Funny how Corbyn's always accused of being best mates with Sinn Fein and the IRA. Well, now Boris are best mates with the DUP, and with the trajectory of fiery rhetoric he's currently on, a tip of the hat to the UVF can't be far behind.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 5 days ago

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"

It's not the same thing at all. Boris was up in front of the DUP only a couple of weeks ago saying, "Northern Ireland is a part of the UK and let it remain so forever! Let it remain so forever!" This is a ridiculous thing to say because the UK had agreed to be neutral on the constitutional status of Northern Ireland, as did the Irish government, which is why it revoked its claim on the territory. This was an arrangement that not only Blair and Brown's Labour had stuck to, but also that Cameron's government respected. Funny how Corbyn's always accused of being best mates with Sinn Fein and the IRA. Well, now Boris are best mates with the DUP, and with the trajectory of fiery rhetoric he's currently on, a tip of the hat to the UVF can't be far behind. "

If you want to hate Goris Zohnson and all Conservatives then that is fine. We live in a free democratic country and you are entitled to do so [I see you are based on the Emerald Isle which is also a free and democratic country] However to imply that there is the slightest connection between the Conservatives and the UVF is both ridiculous and very naïve.

One of the reasons I despise Corbyn and McDonnell is because of their 'support'--or at least failure to condemn the atrocities committed by the IRA. however that is in the past. The original IRA has been disbanded and Sinn Fein are now considered a respectable, mainstream party. Presumably the same applies to the UVF and any connection they may have had with the DUP was tenuous and confined now to history.

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*atamite By *atamite  (M) 5 days ago

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"

It's not the same thing at all. Boris was up in front of the DUP only a couple of weeks ago saying, "Northern Ireland is a part of the UK and let it remain so forever! Let it remain so forever!" This is a ridiculous thing to say because the UK had agreed to be neutral on the constitutional status of Northern Ireland, as did the Irish government, which is why it revoked its claim on the territory. This was an arrangement that not only Blair and Brown's Labour had stuck to, but also that Cameron's government respected. Funny how Corbyn's always accused of being best mates with Sinn Fein and the IRA. Well, now Boris are best mates with the DUP, and with the trajectory of fiery rhetoric he's currently on, a tip of the hat to the UVF can't be far behind.

If you want to hate Goris Zohnson and all Conservatives then that is fine. We live in a free democratic country and you are entitled to do so [I see you are based on the Emerald Isle which is also a free and democratic country] However to imply that there is the slightest connection between the Conservatives and the UVF is both ridiculous and very naïve.

One of the reasons I despise Corbyn and McDonnell is because of their 'support'--or at least failure to condemn the atrocities committed by the IRA. however that is in the past. The original IRA has been disbanded and Sinn Fein are now considered a respectable, mainstream party. Presumably the same applies to the UVF and any connection they may have had with the DUP was tenuous and confined now to history."

I didn't say there was a connection, I said with the firebrand stance he seems to be taking on Northern Ireland and openly siding with the Unionists, he might go one further and say something toward the UVF, or something that could be taken as such, i.e. "I will respect those who fought for the union of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, by continuing to fight for it." That's the kind of gaffe I could see Johnson making.

All I'm saying is that the current UK government is absolutely taking sides within NI as it stands, and that goes against the assurances made in 1998, and that have been kept up until recently. That is wrong and it should end. And it was all for the sake of ten poxy votes in the Commons which are now next to worthless anyway.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 5 days ago

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Now you are just putting imaginary words into Boris Zohnson's mouth. This new expression of 'fake news' springs to mind. For your information all mainstream political parties have been in favour of Northern Ireland staying an integral part of the UK, despite the fact that none of those parties get any representation from that province. I very much doubt that a lot of DUP voters were pro UVF or that many current DUP politicians have any connection with the UVF.

It is difficult to know how to handle the situation which has always been sensitive. In much the same way that the Peace Process has always been fragile. After the 2017 general election those 10 DUP votes in the HOC were vital to keep Mrs May's government in office. Now with Boris' 'purge' they are far less relevant. Hopefully the next general election will bring a more positive result and DUP support can be dispensed with.

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*atamite By *atamite  (M) 5 days ago

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"Now you are just putting imaginary words into Boris Zohnson's mouth. This new expression of 'fake news' springs to mind. For your information all mainstream political parties have been in favour of Northern Ireland staying an integral part of the UK, despite the fact that none of those parties get any representation from that province. I very much doubt that a lot of DUP voters were pro UVF or that many current DUP politicians have any connection with the UVF.

It is difficult to know how to handle the situation which has always been sensitive. In much the same way that the Peace Process has always been fragile. After the 2017 general election those 10 DUP votes in the HOC were vital to keep Mrs May's government in office. Now with Boris' 'purge' they are far less relevant. Hopefully the next general election will bring a more positive result and DUP support can be dispensed with."

I'm not putting any words in Johnson's mouth, but it is the kind of thing I could imagine him saying because he's so reckless with his words.

I don't object necessarily to mainstream UK parties being in favour of maintaining the current union, but I think it tactless and divisive to be so outspoken about it in regards to Northern Ireland. And the only reason they're even doing it is to keep their DUP pals sweet. At some point, this all could die down, and whatever UK government is in charge will probably try to appear neutral towards NI once again. Trouble is that trust will take time to repair.

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By *orum reader  (M) 5 days ago

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"Now you are just putting imaginary words into Boris Zohnson's mouth. This new expression of 'fake news' springs to mind. For your information all mainstream political parties have been in favour of Northern Ireland staying an integral part of the UK, despite the fact that none of those parties get any representation from that province. I very much doubt that a lot of DUP voters were pro UVF or that many current DUP politicians have any connection with the UVF.

It is difficult to know how to handle the situation which has always been sensitive. In much the same way that the Peace Process has always been fragile. After the 2017 general election those 10 DUP votes in the HOC were vital to keep Mrs May's government in office. Now with Boris' 'purge' they are far less relevant. Hopefully the next general election will bring a more positive result and DUP support can be dispensed with."

At least two DUP MPs have connection to the uvf or uda ( Ulster defence association) they are ( according to google ) Emma little Pengelly and Sammy Wilson

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*atamite By *atamite  (M) 2 days ago

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Interesting article in the Belfast Telegraph about the threat of violence from Loyalist Paramilitaries if NI is pushed out of full economic alignment with the rest of the UK.

https://tinyurl.com/y3dleegk

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 2 days ago

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If we had a referendum (cos they are great) on ...

A) Peace in Ireland

or

B) Achieving Brexit

I would vote (A) as in comparison Brexit is meaningless.

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 2 days ago

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"If we had a referendum (cos they are great) on ...

A) Peace in Ireland

or

B) Achieving Brexit

I would vote (A) as in comparison Brexit is meaningless."

I agree 100% because that's the stark choice

Unfortunately not everyone sees it that way - they'll just deny it and say it's just part of project fear. I remember the terrorism.

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By  *ountain    profile verified by photo premium paying member (M) 2 days ago

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I still think Caroline Flint would make a good leader of the labour party. And a good prime minister.

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By *attthew2  (M) 2 days ago

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"If we had a referendum (cos they are great) on ...

A) Peace in Ireland

or

B) Achieving Brexit

I would vote (A) as in comparison Brexit is meaningless.

I agree 100% because that's the stark choice

Unfortunately not everyone sees it that way - they'll just deny it and say it's just part of project fear. I remember the terrorism."

I agree with you both. I lived and worked in West End of London during the late 70’s through to late 80’s. Oxford street bombings etc.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 2 days ago

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Sadly Northern Ireland has always been a thorn in the side if the British government since its creation. A tragic result of Elizabethan and Jacobean colonisation. I do not blame the good people of that troubled province. Just the few who like stirring up trouble. Sectarian violence still exists and is simmering under the surface. I cannot help but think that some are using Brexit to derail the peace process or use it as yet another excuse to try and stop Brexit.

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By *arits   premium paying member (TV/TS/CD) 2 days ago

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Some short memories here. The UVF is far less important to the conflict than the fact that the

Police force, overwhelmingly Protestant, was the main instrument of repression. This was even more tripue of the paramilitary section, the B speecials. Catholics suffered discrimination from the public authorities and in jobs and intimidatory violence when they objected, every day. It was only the Civil Rights movement, and, sadly, the formation of a revived armed resistance that for ced a rethink by the British government. The Conservatives were of course in bed with the leaders of the oppression who kept their hands clean and left the dirty work to those below.

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By *arits   premium paying member (TV/TS/CD) 2 days ago

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Please excuse the typos. However for ced is not a typo. Try posting it as one word.

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 2 days ago

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"Sadly Northern Ireland has always been a thorn in the side if the British government since its creation. A tragic result of Elizabethan and Jacobean colonisation. I do not blame the good people of that troubled province. Just the few who like stirring up trouble. Sectarian violence still exists and is simmering under the surface. I cannot help but think that some are using Brexit to derail the peace process or use it as yet another excuse to try and stop Brexit."

That’s true enough.

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By *heshire baldie  (M) 2 days ago

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"Sadly Northern Ireland has always been a thorn in the side if the British government since its creation. A tragic result of Elizabethan and Jacobean colonisation. I do not blame the good people of that troubled province. Just the few who like stirring up trouble. Sectarian violence still exists and is simmering under the surface. I cannot help but think that some are using Brexit to derail the peace process or use it as yet another excuse to try and stop Brexit.

That’s true enough. "

I think that they’ve painted themselves into a corner and they don’t have the slightest idea how to get out of it

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 1 day ago

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There are (unconfirmed, of course) suggestions that the DUP are being offered 'billions, not millions' as a sweetener. Now that would be a big surprise!

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 1 day ago

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"There are (unconfirmed, of course) suggestions that the DUP are being offered 'billions, not millions' as a sweetener. Now that would be a big surprise!"

It would be a surprise. Probably best to wait for details and also to see a breakdown on what projects are being funded with any monies allocated via the DUP.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 1 day ago

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Wonder where that info came from. Momentum HQ perhaps?

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 1 day ago

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"Wonder where that info came from. Momentum HQ perhaps?

"

Wrong. Maybe you will be like Rees-Smug and eat your words if it turns out the be true. Bon appetit.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 1 day ago

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For a start if any extra money is offered it will be for Northern Ireland and not for Arlene Foster, Ian Paisley Jnr et al to have a Christmas knees-up. Also I cannot see why they need to be offered anything with the prospect of a general election in the very near future. That's if the scaredy cats on the opposition benches will allow one.

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*astkenter By *astkenter  (M) 1 day ago

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Well, we can only wait and see. In the meantime, keep on giving it a Tory spin to make it seem like a good idea. As for the election, only a fool would grant Bozo the election he so desperately wants. How do we know when he's lying? He opens his mouth.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 1 day ago

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" How do we know when he's lying? He opens his mouth."

Bit like your old pal Jezbollah Corbyn then

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*atamite By *atamite  (M) 21 hours ago

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"Sadly Northern Ireland has always been a thorn in the side if the British government since its creation. A tragic result of Elizabethan and Jacobean colonisation. I do not blame the good people of that troubled province. Just the few who like stirring up trouble. Sectarian violence still exists and is simmering under the surface. I cannot help but think that some are using Brexit to derail the peace process or use it as yet another excuse to try and stop Brexit."

It's maybe not said enough but the overwhelming majority of people in Northern Ireland are perfectly normal. They get on pretty well. Belfast city centre is marvellous. I've worked up there before on the week of July 12th and even walked around some supposedly Unionist/Loyalist estates with the UVF/UDA flags flying off of lampposts, kerbs painted red, white and blue, little boys walking around practising their marching, and the great big 'tower of babel' bonfires being built off in the distance. Even then, the locals were gave us no hassle after hearing our southern Irish accents.

But between those estates, the big scary murals and the so-called 'peace' walls which still divide communities, it's evident that it is, and probably always will be, a fragile peace, and we'll upset it at our collective peril.

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By *ikey1973   profile verified by photo (M) 18 hours ago

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"Sadly Northern Ireland has always been a thorn in the side if the British government since its creation. A tragic result of Elizabethan and Jacobean colonisation. I do not blame the good people of that troubled province. Just the few who like stirring up trouble. Sectarian violence still exists and is simmering under the surface. I cannot help but think that some are using Brexit to derail the peace process or use it as yet another excuse to try and stop Brexit.

It's maybe not said enough but the overwhelming majority of people in Northern Ireland are perfectly normal. They get on pretty well. Belfast city centre is marvellous. I've worked up there before on the week of July 12th and even walked around some supposedly Unionist/Loyalist estates with the UVF/UDA flags flying off of lampposts, kerbs painted red, white and blue, little boys walking around practising their marching, and the great big 'tower of babel' bonfires being built off in the distance. Even then, the locals were gave us no hassle after hearing our southern Irish accents.

But between those estates, the big scary murals and the so-called 'peace' walls which still divide communities, it's evident that it is, and probably always will be, a fragile peace, and we'll upset it at our collective peril. "

You are spot on.

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*ordic-knight By *ordic-knight   premium paying member (M) 6 hours ago

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"Sadly Northern Ireland has always been a thorn in the side if the British government since its creation. A tragic result of Elizabethan and Jacobean colonisation. I do not blame the good people of that troubled province. Just the few who like stirring up trouble. Sectarian violence still exists and is simmering under the surface. I cannot help but think that some are using Brexit to derail the peace process or use it as yet another excuse to try and stop Brexit.

It's maybe not said enough but the overwhelming majority of people in Northern Ireland are perfectly normal. They get on pretty well. Belfast city centre is marvellous. I've worked up there before on the week of July 12th and even walked around some supposedly Unionist/Loyalist estates with the UVF/UDA flags flying off of lampposts, kerbs painted red, white and blue, little boys walking around practising their marching, and the great big 'tower of babel' bonfires being built off in the distance. Even then, the locals were gave us no hassle after hearing our southern Irish accents.

But between those estates, the big scary murals and the so-called 'peace' walls which still divide communities, it's evident that it is, and probably always will be, a fragile peace, and we'll upset it at our collective peril. "

On the whole Catamite I agree with you. Nothing wrong whatsoever with the vast majority of Northern Irish people who just want to live in peace and get on with their lives. I was in NI twice at the height of the 'Troubles' and the average person was friendly enough and did not want to be involved. It is like with so many issues, a vociferous few give the many a bad name.

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